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Post by VampSlayer on Oct 18, 2010 14:27:04 GMT -5
^^ Uh, you do realize you wouldn't have your precious supporting characters to care about if it weren't for Eliza/Echo, right? Yep, and I thank Eliza for it. But that doesn't mean the other stars of the show shouldn't be allowed some credit. All I'm trying to get at, as is Eric, is that Eliza/Echo doesn't hold this show up all on her own. There's a whole cast of actors and characters, not just Eliza and her own role. Putting her beautiful face all over each disc is a bit repetitive, IMHO, and I don't understand why they didn't decide to share the 'disc face time' with the other actors/actresses. If I remember correctly, the supporting stars were placed on the Season One DVD dics. (The way it should be.) I understand if you're all, "Eliza made this show. She's the star. Give her a cookie." But please try to respect my opinion on this. I think the whole cast deserves recognition for their work, not just one person.
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Post by abuffyfan on Oct 18, 2010 14:53:11 GMT -5
^^ Uh, you do realize you wouldn't have your precious supporting characters to care about if it weren't for Eliza/Echo, right? Yep, and I thank Eliza for it. But that doesn't mean the other stars of the show shouldn't be allowed some credit. All I'm trying to get at, as is Eric, is that Eliza/Echo doesn't hold this show up all on her own. There's a whole cast of actors and characters, not just Eliza and her own role. Putting her beautiful face all over each disc is a bit repetitive, IMHO, and I don't understand why they didn't decide to share the 'disc face time' with the other actors/actresses. If I remember correctly, the supporting stars were placed on the Season One DVD dics. (The way it should be.) I understand if you're all, "Eliza made this show. She's the star. Give her a cookie." But please try to respect my opinion on this. I think the whole cast deserves recognition for their work, not just one person. You certainly don't respect my opinion about it. I'm just tired of people trying to put the supporting players on the same level as the star. The most important aspect of the show is Eliza/Echo, and the rest of the cast already gets the respect they deserve as supporting players.
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Post by VampSlayer on Oct 18, 2010 15:14:46 GMT -5
Yep, and I thank Eliza for it. But that doesn't mean the other stars of the show shouldn't be allowed some credit. All I'm trying to get at, as is Eric, is that Eliza/Echo doesn't hold this show up all on her own. There's a whole cast of actors and characters, not just Eliza and her own role. Putting her beautiful face all over each disc is a bit repetitive, IMHO, and I don't understand why they didn't decide to share the 'disc face time' with the other actors/actresses. If I remember correctly, the supporting stars were placed on the Season One DVD dics. (The way it should be.) I understand if you're all, "Eliza made this show. She's the star. Give her a cookie." But please try to respect my opinion on this. I think the whole cast deserves recognition for their work, not just one person. You certainly don't respect my opinion about it. I'm just tired of people trying to put the supporting players on the same level as the star. The most important aspect of the show is Eliza/Echo, and the rest of the cast already gets the respect they deserve as supporting players. The most important aspect of the show is most certainly not Eliza, or even Echo. The most important aspect(s) of the show are the topics it deals with. I think Joss himself would agree with me, as would almost any viewer of the show. Now that I've tried to show my point, I think I'm done here. I do respect your opinion, so please do the same for my own.
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Post by abuffyfan on Oct 18, 2010 17:14:18 GMT -5
You certainly don't respect my opinion about it. I'm just tired of people trying to put the supporting players on the same level as the star. The most important aspect of the show is Eliza/Echo, and the rest of the cast already gets the respect they deserve as supporting players. The most important aspect of the show is most certainly not Eliza, or even Echo. The most important aspect(s) of the show are the topics it deals with. I think Joss himself would agree with me, as would almost any viewer of the show. Now that I've tried to show my point, I think I'm done here. I do respect your opinion, so please do the same for my own. And I'm pretty sure FOX would agree with me that Eliza/Echo is the most important aspect of the show, not the "themes".
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Post by abuffyfan on Oct 21, 2010 16:52:27 GMT -5
Just re-watched The Attic. Cannot believe I thought that fancy editing had created "Victor #2"! I found a photo on IMDB from that scene and it identified which one was Enver and which was his brother, but if I hadn't have seen that photo, I wouldn't have been able to tell who was who.
(I love identical twins...I think they're the coolest thing in the world, and I wish I had one! I would've convinced my twin to take PE for me in high school and in return I would have "switched" with him for math or English or something.)
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Josh
Novice Witch
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Posts: 265
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Post by Josh on Oct 21, 2010 19:33:39 GMT -5
The most important aspect of the show is most certainly not Eliza, or even Echo. The most important aspect(s) of the show are the topics it deals with. I think Joss himself would agree with me, as would almost any viewer of the show. Now that I've tried to show my point, I think I'm done here. I do respect your opinion, so please do the same for my own. And I'm pretty sure FOX would agree with me that Eliza/Echo is the most important aspect of the show, not the "themes". And I'm pretty sure Fox is evil and also the reason why both Firefly and Dollhouse ended up on friday nights and canceled (along with Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles) and why the first part of Dollhouse Season 1 (which is most people's biggest complaint about the show) felt so slow.
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Post by wenxina on Oct 21, 2010 20:58:21 GMT -5
Have you ever watched FOX News?! I was on a research cruise, and for a week straight, the only channel on the TV, which was always on for some reason, was FOX News. After the first day or two, I wanted to tear my hair out... it's not news! It's plastic-y looking women and men with douchebag faces reading sensationalized crap.
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Post by abuffyfan on Oct 21, 2010 22:18:15 GMT -5
Just rewatched "The Hollow Men"....when they are evacuating the building at the end, you hear (but don't see) Topher say, "I got Saunders out". I don't remember this line from the original broadcast. Was it dubbed in for the DVD? I remember being so confused as to how she could go from being unconscious (and evil) in the about-to-explode building and then pop up fairly normal in "Epitaph One".
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Post by Eric on Oct 21, 2010 22:21:40 GMT -5
Just rewatched "The Hollow Men"....when they are evacuating the building at the end, you hear (but don't see) Topher say, "I got Saunders out". I don't remember this line from the original broadcast. Was it dubbed in for the DVD? I remember being so confused as to how she could go from being unconscious (and evil) in the about-to-explode building and then pop up fairly normal in "Epitaph One". It was in the original broadcast. Sometime between The Hollow Men and Epitaph One, Echo and co. obviously imprinted her with the Claire Saunder personality again.
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Josh
Novice Witch
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 265
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Post by Josh on Oct 21, 2010 22:23:28 GMT -5
Just rewatched "The Hollow Men"....when they are evacuating the building at the end, you hear (but don't see) Topher say, "I got Saunders out". I don't remember this line from the original broadcast. Was it dubbed in for the DVD? I remember being so confused as to how she could go from being unconscious (and evil) in the about-to-explode building and then pop up fairly normal in "Epitaph One". I don't remember even hearing it in the DVD watching it a second time so it's probably just one of those things that's easily missed.
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Post by abuffyfan on Oct 21, 2010 23:03:54 GMT -5
Just rewatched "The Hollow Men"....when they are evacuating the building at the end, you hear (but don't see) Topher say, "I got Saunders out". I don't remember this line from the original broadcast. Was it dubbed in for the DVD? I remember being so confused as to how she could go from being unconscious (and evil) in the about-to-explode building and then pop up fairly normal in "Epitaph One". It was in the original broadcast. Sometime between The Hollow Men and Epitaph One, Echo and co. obviously imprinted her with the Claire Saunder personality again. So all this time I've been confused for nothing...dammit!! Thanks!
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Post by VampSlayer on Oct 21, 2010 23:50:57 GMT -5
Just rewatched "The Hollow Men"....when they are evacuating the building at the end, you hear (but don't see) Topher say, "I got Saunders out". I don't remember this line from the original broadcast. Was it dubbed in for the DVD? I remember being so confused as to how she could go from being unconscious (and evil) in the about-to-explode building and then pop up fairly normal in "Epitaph One". It was in the original broadcast. Sometime between The Hollow Men and Epitaph One, Echo and co. obviously imprinted her with the Claire Saunder personality again. Yeah, it was definitely in the original airing. I spazzed about it for two weeks after hearing it. (I still kinda wish we had seen Claire/Whiskey one more time. Her final shot is her passed out on the floor... What an exit. )
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-'Goldilocks
Potential Slayer
I could eat that word...or a crisp![Mo0:25]
Posts: 144
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Post by -'Goldilocks on Oct 22, 2010 1:54:25 GMT -5
As its not shown if Whiskey died or not, I would have loved for Alpha to have imprinted her with the Claire imprint. That way she could be the doctor for the remaining dolls in the house and we get more Claire!
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Post by Eric on Oct 22, 2010 7:53:23 GMT -5
As its not shown if Whiskey died or not, I would have loved for Alpha to have imprinted her with the Claire imprint. That way she could be the doctor for the remaining dolls in the house and we get more Claire! I like to think that Alpha imprinted her with her original personality and then let her go.
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Josh
Novice Witch
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Post by Josh on Oct 22, 2010 8:27:27 GMT -5
As its not shown if Whiskey died or not, I would have loved for Alpha to have imprinted her with the Claire imprint. That way she could be the doctor for the remaining dolls in the house and we get more Claire! Didn't she unleash a gas that killed the people intruding in Epitaph One? Unless I'm completely off my rocker and my memory is distorting this event I would have thought the gas did kill her since she just stayed in the room. I really do wish that we had gotten to meet Whiskey's original personality though. I don't see why we couldn't/wouldn't.
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Post by abuffyfan on Oct 22, 2010 9:39:34 GMT -5
Up until Epitaph Two, I would have said Saunders lived. But her absence in Part Two suggests that she died in the Dollhouse.
If I had only heard "I got Saunders out" way back in January, I wouldn't have spent months frustrated and wondering how she ended up back in the Dollhouse for Epitaph One!
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Post by VampSlayer on Oct 22, 2010 15:08:32 GMT -5
As its not shown if Whiskey died or not, I would have loved for Alpha to have imprinted her with the Claire imprint. That way she could be the doctor for the remaining dolls in the house and we get more Claire! Not to sound too promotional-y, but I wrote a fanfic with that exact plot. I'd like to think Whiskey lived, but the odds seem to be against the hopeful, sadly. I also think it was a bit disappointing that we never got to meet her original self. (I also think it's a bit morally wrong that her original self never got placed back in her own body. [Same issue for Mellie/Madeline.]) And since this conversation is a lot off topic, I'll start a thread dedicated to Claire/Whiskey's fate. Feel free to look for it, and join in the topic there.
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Josh
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Post by Josh on Oct 23, 2010 8:35:41 GMT -5
As its not shown if Whiskey died or not, I would have loved for Alpha to have imprinted her with the Claire imprint. That way she could be the doctor for the remaining dolls in the house and we get more Claire! Not to sound too promotional-y, but I wrote a fanfic with that exact plot. I'd like to think Whiskey lived, but the odds seem to be against the hopeful, sadly. I also think it was a bit disappointing that we never got to meet her original self. (I also think it's a bit morally wrong that her original self never got placed back in her own body. [Same issue for Mellie/Madeline.]) And since this conversation is a lot off topic, I'll start a thread dedicated to Claire/Whiskey's fate. Feel free to look for it, and join in the topic there. Well they were using Mellie again which was why that imprint happened and then they just never got the chance to bring Madeline back.
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Post by abuffyfan on Oct 23, 2010 9:12:11 GMT -5
Having just watched Season 2 episodes 1-12, then Epitaph One, then Epitaph Two, I have a bunch of questions I'm hoping y'all can clear up...
After blowing up Rossum, wouldn't Echo and co. be majorly wanted by other Rossumers like Ambrose and Harding? Wouldn't it be very easy to find them seeing as they went back to the Dollhouse?
Did they return to the Dollhouse and stay "in business"? It appears in Epitaph One that they acquired new Dolls and things stayed business as usual.
When did the Victor/Ambrose kitchen scene occur?
If I can think of more, I'll ask. Thanks in advance!
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