Reluctant Hero
Potential Slayer
To read makes our speaking English good. [Mo0:15]
Posts: 104
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Post by Reluctant Hero on Jul 9, 2009 23:03:17 GMT -5
I love Giles, let me just say that, but I always felt that Wesley in Angel was a lot smarter then Giles. Maybe it's just because they focused more on the research part in Angel, but Wesley just seemed to know more. He was always talking about all the different languages he had to read and cross referencing things. Wesley worked really hard, especially in the earlier seasons when he didn't really have anyone to help him. I mean Angel and Cordelia helped but they didn't have specific talents like how Willow could hack and then learned magic.
What do you guys think?
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Hellbound Hyperion
Bad Ass Wicca
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Post by Hellbound Hyperion on Jul 10, 2009 0:08:40 GMT -5
Different personalities, different manner of researching. Giles was known as "Ripper" as a teenager; he's clearly more rebellious than the rest of the Watcher's Council, as seen throughout BtVS. Wesley, on the other hand, was always trying to impress his father, to make him proud - Head Boy at the Watcher's Academy, always ahead of the class, super-smart, almost nerdy type.
That, and I imagine working on the front lines of L.A.'s demon underworld would give Wesley a more infinite resource of knowledge about demons, magicks, and the like than with Giles just trying to train Buffy and help keep her alive. Wesley was always constantly researching, Giles only reaches for a book when he needs to.
That's what I've always perceived as the difference between the two. Of course, things change a bit in Angel Season Three, but as far as the researching goes, what I've said is pretty constant throughout the shows.
EDIT: And then while the Watcher's Council is destroyed, leaving Giles to lift just enough information to understand The First Evil (along with any other demon resources he had from his days as Watcher), Wesley is handed the keys to Wolfram & Hart's own library, which is probably infinitely more complete in terms of knowledge than most of what Giles would've had by the end of Buffy Season Seven.
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Post by Skytteflickan88 on Jul 10, 2009 3:43:15 GMT -5
I have now idea who's smarter or who knows more about magic or demons or mythology.
I mean there's a difference between being intelligent and knowing much.
I honestly can't say who knows more or who's got more brains. Just because Wesley is seen researching more, doesn't mean Giles doesn't study off screen(and he has had more time to study than the younger Wesley).
That Wes did have W&H's library at his disposal doesn't necassary mean he knows more than Giles. But since they were both sent to watch slayers, I guess they might have equal skill(not physically tough, I still don't get that they sent a dude who only staked two vampires to the Hellmouth).
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gumgnome
Junior Vampire Slayer
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Post by gumgnome on Jul 10, 2009 4:02:58 GMT -5
I think you're correct on this one Hellbound Hyperion. Wesley is definitely the nerdy book type watcher while Giles, while not averse to this kind of learning, certainly has done less of it than Wesley.
Whether that makes Wesley smarter is another matter. Hellbound Hyperion highlights the most important motivation for Wesley for most of the time we see him on our screens: trying to impress his father. This clearly made him learn and retain vast reams of information without any clear conception as to how it would be useful.
Giles, on the other hand, rebelled against the classical form of learning (sent down while studying history at Oxford) and learned from the world - dabbling in black magics in London in the 70s. In this way, he is almost certainly more worldly than Wesley, which we see on the shows many times can be a very valuable asset.
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Post by PJ on Jul 10, 2009 8:59:52 GMT -5
I never really was a big fan of wesley. just bc no one liked him in buffy & he was a little annoying. So Giles wins my vote!
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Post by Skytteflickan88 on Jul 10, 2009 9:16:54 GMT -5
I never really was a big fan of wesley. just bc no one liked him in buffy & he was a little annoying. So Giles wins my vote! You think Giles is smarter and knows more about the supernatural because he was less annoying and more well-liked than Wesley?
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Post by PJ on Jul 10, 2009 15:53:19 GMT -5
I never really was a big fan of wesley. just bc no one liked him in buffy & he was a little annoying. So Giles wins my vote! You think Giles is smarter and knows more about the supernatural because he was less annoying and more well-liked than Wesley? no......lol. now answering the question of who is smarter, i still think Giles is better. Just bc he has a little bit more experience.
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Hallow Thorn
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Post by Hallow Thorn on Jul 10, 2009 17:49:51 GMT -5
If it's a 'book smarts' fight I think Wesley would win... well I think he would win all types of fight vs. Giles, well, season 4-5 Wesley anyway.
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Hellbound Hyperion
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Post by Hellbound Hyperion on Jul 10, 2009 20:39:53 GMT -5
I think I'd like to know a little more about Giles' family life before I could make any real call on Giles v. Wesley though. My post is very pro-Wes, but Giles does have that street-wise intelligence that Wesley was missing until he went to L.A. and started working for Angel.
Still... why does Giles rebel? That's something I'd like to see more of. We know why Wesley is so intent on learning so much worthless knowledge, so why does Giles not find it important?
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Post by henzINNIT on Jul 11, 2009 5:54:48 GMT -5
Giles was a stuffy watcher type when the show started too. He rebelled but must have settled down enough to become a "qualified" watcher. Wes may have been more of a book worm but we saw that that amounted to nothing in the field with no life experience. I think Giles edged him out because of that, but by the end of both shows they were pretty equal.
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gumgnome
Junior Vampire Slayer
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Post by gumgnome on Jul 11, 2009 7:09:59 GMT -5
Giles didn't want to be a Watcher, but was told that he would be from a young age. He wanted to be a fighter pilot/grocer and so rebelled against his 'destiny' by flunking out of Oxford and living in a funky demon acid coolade for a while. Then when his friend died due to the group's negligence letting Eyghon take control and kill him, Giles goes back to the Watcher path and tries to make amends for his choices. I guess unlike Wesley, Giles battle is with himself - two sides of a man warring for dominance.
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Post by Skytteflickan88 on Jul 11, 2009 8:19:12 GMT -5
Still... why does Giles rebel? That's something I'd like to see more of. We know why Wesley is so intent on learning so much worthless knowledge, so why does Giles not find it important? Worthless knowledge? Which part?
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Randi Giles
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Post by Randi Giles on Jul 11, 2009 12:29:56 GMT -5
Their both awesome.
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Post by buffyfan21 on Jul 11, 2009 13:28:07 GMT -5
I don't want to say that one is better/smarter than the other because I really do love them both. I think that Wesley and Giles are both smart in their own right and that they both have different levels of experience. I don't think that this makes one more or less qualified over the other. Both men should be commended for the great work that they contributed in the fight against evil.
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Post by ryonizdabest on Jul 17, 2009 15:11:33 GMT -5
Iam sure Angel ask Giles for help about illyria ......
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Post by Skytteflickan88 on Jul 17, 2009 16:07:12 GMT -5
Iam sure Angel ask Giles for help about illyria ...... You mean the phone-call? When Angel called, looking for Willow? What about it?
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The Night Lord
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Post by The Night Lord on Jul 17, 2009 19:35:24 GMT -5
Angel called Giles asking for Willow to help Fred. He wanted Willow's help and Giles was the only one who could tell him where our favourite red-headed witch was. Well, I'm assuming that Angel only has Giles' number and not Willow's or Buffy's
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Hellbound Hyperion
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Post by Hellbound Hyperion on Jul 17, 2009 20:49:51 GMT -5
Angel called Giles asking for Willow to help Fred. He wanted Willow's help and Giles was the only one who could tell him where our favourite red-headed witch was. Well, I'm assuming that Angel only has Giles' number and not Willow's or Buffy's That, and what Andrew says in Damage leads me to believe that Buffy and the others cut themselves off from Team Angel when they took over W&H. They're all split up, too, but Angel probably guessed (rightly so, apparently) that Giles would want to keep close to his own home in England after the events of Sunnydale. Buffy and Xander lock up in a castle in Scotland, Faith is in Cleveland (most likely), and Willow is probably one of the most powerful witches that's ever lived - she could literally be anywhere, probably far beyond the reaches of W&H's evil hands. (Just hypothesizing)
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Post by Skytteflickan88 on Jul 18, 2009 6:26:17 GMT -5
Sounds about right HH.
Although, I'm not sure if Buffy really cut herself off, or the others. Maybe they said "Huh, Angel seems to be evil now. Too bad were busy. Let's just do as before, and have almost no contact with him."
Wait, no, Angelus has tried to end the world before... They should have found time to fix it. Maybe they made Willow do a spell to check if he had his soul and just assumed that Angel had gone bad, or that he was working a plan(which he was). Either way, they all seemed busy, maybe busy enough to ignore Angel. And of course, drama-queen Andrew thought that meant they were un non-speaking terms. And Giles, still pissed off about Jenny, choose to assume the worst, while the other scoobies, just didn't care.
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Hellbound Hyperion
Bad Ass Wicca
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Post by Hellbound Hyperion on Jul 18, 2009 16:54:29 GMT -5
Ehh, I don't necessarily think it'd be because of Jenny. If Giles thought Angelus was back, a phone conversation would give it away. Angel sounded delirious and desperate on the phone with Giles in "Shells" - that's not Angelus's style, ever.
But I think you're right about the Scoobies being too busy. Even Angel and Spike were so busy they didn't realize the full extent of Buffy's plan in "Chosen" until "Damages" and Dana. 1800 is a not-small number of girls.
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