Maggie
Innocent Bystander
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 48
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Post by Maggie on Aug 6, 2010 11:03:38 GMT -5
Xander walking out of a cave read to me as Xander walking out of the hellmouth -- which has to play a key role in this return to SD... the closing of the hellmouth is mentioned in #37, and was directly linked to the slayer spell and might be part of what's made the world "all different".
Great, great image of Xander and his love for Dawn. I've always liked Xander/Dawn -- but this picture broke my heart, even though I do think it's now less likely that she'll die and stay dead. (I think I'm betting on die, and be resurrected because she's actually a key).
I've long thought Dawn was toast; this cover makes me think that's less likely -- though it does make me feel vindicated because at the very least there will be some flirtation with death. Using up the cover at this late juncture for a simple injury would seem a bit strange.
Am delighted to see Spike on another cover. The blurb specifically mentions "super" Buffy, which calls attention to the fact that unless Spike is also super-duper-powered up he ought not be fighting with her side-by-side. Lots of ways that could go -- he could be super-powered up; the writers could be downplaying Buffy's super-duper strength, or the image is mostly symbolic of the fact that Spike's solidly on Buffy's side fighting against the apocalypse she and Angel unleashed.
I don't read Angel as being punished for being a naughty Twilight guy. I read him as having to answer to his master for having failed to persuade Buffy to leave the world behind in smoking ruins in order to go on to Shangri-La with her honey. Angel going 'unwillingly' means he's no longer on board with the screw the world let's get to paradise program -- but it sounds like he's in over his head. I'm wondering if he isn't the prince Buffy has to go rescue. Or if her inability to rescue him because of the massive apocalypse she's trying to fight off isn't part of the epic tragedy that we've been promised.
While it's hard to believe that Angel would get permanently dusted -- the stakes are high enough for that to be the 'right' out come for this story. Allie said Angel will have some role in season 9, but that could be covering a very big spoiler. The huge noise about big tragedy -- in conjunction with the shipping issues makes me wonder. FWIW, I don't think it's impossible that Buffy's the one who goes down for the count in a permanent sort of way.
The seed comes in out of left field, and I most like the theories that connect it with the broken egg. The Dawn/Xander cover makes me think it's Xander who works to protect the seed -- he's the one who's closest to Buffy at this point, and we haven't had dramatic bang out of the huge attention paid to Buffy/Xander this season. All in all very interesting stuff. And now we're less than four weeks away from it starting -- with a Riley pick-me-up just a few weeks away. So happy that the long wait is drawing to a close.
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Aug 6, 2010 11:14:57 GMT -5
Angel won't, and probably can't, be dusted as long as IDW has a license for the character. Especially since the Dark Horse/IDW relationship now seems to be tending toward less antagonism rather than more.
I wonder why, if Buffy is now working directly against the designs of "the Universe," she's still allowed the superpowers it supposedly gave her? That leads me to suspect that the source of those powers is a lot more complicated than "instant evolution to create a new race." I'll bet Willow was at least partly correct with her "dead Slayers" theory, and I think the Scythe has something very central to do with it.
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Dorotea
Potential Slayer
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 145
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Post by Dorotea on Aug 6, 2010 11:32:05 GMT -5
Angel won't, and probably can't, be dusted as long as IDW has a license for the character. Especially since the Dark Horse/IDW relationship now seems to be tending toward less antagonism rather than more. Angel *can be* but won't be dusted for a bunch of various reasons that have nothing to do with IDW holding a license for the character. Just to remind you - we were told that the verse is inching towards the Fray future and we are getting closer to it. ( keeping my fingers crossed for it). IDW don't and won't have the license for the Fray verse - thus once characters are moved into S9 they are off reach by IDW, or at least I think so. They can do all the stories they like with pre-S8 A/S ( which was confirmed by BL recently). I doubt they would try to have another run of Angel comic set post S8 and pre- S9 and post S9. As to 'why' Angel cannot be dusted. *Smirk* Too many flash-forwards and Easter eggs were hidden within the S8 already to doubt it. That actually leads me to suspect ( as I did all along ) that the Universe is not truly an evil entity and that the 'balance was destroyed - now it will be found again' theme will be played by the end of the season. Same as the 'Buffy was the only Slayer to ever get out of the maze' message.
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Aug 6, 2010 12:42:26 GMT -5
That actually leads me to suspect ( as I did all along ) that the Universe is not truly an evil entity and that the 'balance was destroyed - now it will be found again' theme will be played by the end of the season. Same as the 'Buffy was the only Slayer to ever get out of the maze' message. IMO, summoning armies of demons to murder the entire human race is pretty much the gold standard of "evil." Or completely uncaring, which is functionally the same thing.
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Maggie
Innocent Bystander
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 48
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Post by Maggie on Aug 6, 2010 13:22:40 GMT -5
Angel won't, and probably can't, be dusted as long as IDW has a license for the character. Especially since the Dark Horse/IDW relationship now seems to be tending toward less antagonism rather than more. The IDW card was used to argue that Twilight couldn't be Angel, and we've all since seen how well that worked out. We've long been told by Allie and Jeanty (and I think even Joss) that the whole world will be completely changed by the end of season 8 -- most especially as it relates to slayers and vampires. So I think anything is on the table. Jeanty early on said that the Twilight reveal would be a Very Big Deal, and he just wasn't wrong about that. He's made similar Very Big Deal remarks about the end, and so I take that seriously. I don't attach a high probability to Angel's permanent demise, but I think it's a mistake to rule anything out based on 'meta' concerns like IDW or ground rules for what not to do to your main characters. I agree with all of this. Indeed, we've now been told that Giles is only partly right about what's going on (just as Willow was only partly right). They've pretty much been wildly speculating just like the fandom has been wildly speculating! I think it's more likely than not that there will be a person behind all this rather than just mindless forces of the universe.
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Dorotea
Potential Slayer
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 145
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Post by Dorotea on Aug 6, 2010 13:45:39 GMT -5
That actually leads me to suspect ( as I did all along ) that the Universe is not truly an evil entity and that the 'balance was destroyed - now it will be found again' theme will be played by the end of the season. Same as the 'Buffy was the only Slayer to ever get out of the maze' message. IMO, summoning armies of demons to murder the entire human race is pretty much the gold standard of "evil." Or completely uncaring, which is functionally the same thing. IMHO, were are led to assume the Universe summoned the armies of demons to slaughter the entirety of human race. We were also given a list of different hints earlier in the game that for one reason or another were obscured and are now never brought up. For starters - 'the end of magic' clause and 'I welcome this coming war'. Universe can be very well neutral - but somebody or great many things might be hitching a ride on its coattails. What I am trying to do here - to clarify myself - is to separate the 'giving of powers' from opening of the dimensional cracks and pouring demons. One does not have to be logically linked to another with intent. It might be that opening of the Twilight plane was used by something else as a good moment to pry at the weakening barriers. Or great many other things - like the barriers being already weakened by the multiplication of Slayers and the cracking of the dimensions coming to pass regardless of Twilight - with Twilight only accelerating it but not being the original cause. Heck, I can give you ten different scenarios explaining why the Uni did not really 'mean' it.
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Aug 6, 2010 14:48:50 GMT -5
I'm going to be very disappointed if "the Universe" is really all there is to the Big Bad this season. Something else is pursuing an agenda here.
It could be that the Universe is just as Nature is in the real world... a completely dispassionate, amoral force that is concerned only with the system itself (the balance), and is absolutely indifferent to the happiness or suffering of individuals, or even entire species. If so, the Scoobies could solve the problem by just coming up with an alternate way to correct the balance that doesn't involve the killing of humanity.
But the Twilight event seems like it's something that's been planned (prophecied) for a long, long time... a proactive event rather than a reactive one. The way things are happening screams "magic" rather than "nature."
The Slayers may very well be causing an imbalance in the natural order... but the fact is that nature, left to itself, simply doesn't move to correct imbalance this quickly. Humanity has been an unbalancing factor in nature since we harnessed fire... yet here we still are.
Something else is going on here.
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Maggie
Innocent Bystander
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 48
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Post by Maggie on Aug 6, 2010 14:59:52 GMT -5
But the Twilight event seems like it's something that's been planned (prophecied) for a long, long time... a proactive event rather than a reactive one. The way things are happening screams "magic" rather than "nature." The blurb seems to be on your side: "...As Twilight [Angel] was given a clear mission in regard to Buffy..." The mindless universe may push people around, but it doesn't give them messages or missions. Maybe the 'universe' is a person, or maybe the big bad is someone else -- but we're not just watching the working out of mechanical laws. Someone is involved.
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Tea - Total
Bad Ass Wicca
?The hardest thing in this world is to ...live in it....? [Mo0:4]
Posts: 2,118
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Post by Tea - Total on Aug 7, 2010 10:31:05 GMT -5
What if Angel (Twilight) is actually the First. Manipulating Buffy to think that their are creating a new world without pain and misery. But what if its just a manipulation to make them think that but really its just a glamor, so that means the first has an opportunity of tipping the scale of good and evil, so the first can be corporal. And dawn could be a threat toward the first plans so The first manipulating Xander to kill dawn. I wish. Because i don't get how the first quoted in season 7 "its not spike time yet", so that gives me hope doesn't it?
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Post by drywallman on Aug 7, 2010 11:46:27 GMT -5
What if Angel (Twilight) is actually the First. Manipulating Buffy to think that their are creating a new world without pain and misery. But what if its just a manipulation to make them think that but really its just a glamor, so that means the first has an opportunity of tipping the scale of good and evil, so the first can be corporal. And dawn could be a threat toward the first plans so The first manipulating Xander to kill dawn. I wish. Because i don't get how the first quoted in season 7 "its not spike time yet", so that gives me hope doesn't it? Whats not go get? The First had a plan for Spike, hence it manipulating him and screwing with his head, but its plans went awry when Buffy helped him get off the crazy train to wackytown.
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ruby
Common Vampire
Grenadey-girl in green
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 66
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Post by ruby on Aug 7, 2010 14:21:00 GMT -5
How could Angel be the First? He's proven he's corporeal? Plus I doubt Joss would give us a huge Angel's Twilight reveal then say "Whoops guys sorry, just kidding!"
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Tea - Total
Bad Ass Wicca
?The hardest thing in this world is to ...live in it....? [Mo0:4]
Posts: 2,118
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Post by Tea - Total on Aug 7, 2010 15:23:00 GMT -5
What if Angel (Twilight) is actually the First. Manipulating Buffy to think that their are creating a new world without pain and misery. But what if its just a manipulation to make them think that but really its just a glamor, so that means the first has an opportunity of tipping the scale of good and evil, so the first can be corporal. And dawn could be a threat toward the first plans so The first manipulating Xander to kill dawn. I wish. Because i don't get how the first quoted in season 7 "its not spike time yet", so that gives me hope doesn't it? Whats not go get? The First had a plan for Spike, hence it manipulating him and screwing with his head, but its plans went awry when Buffy helped him get off the crazy train to wackytown. Obviously. But that was after when Buffy believed him (Never Leave Me) and she helped him. The first said that way after that. Spike, (First Date) "It, uh, it talked to the little boy. Said it wasn't time for me yet. I should move out. Leave town before it is time for me". Nothing happened major. ruby, the first can imerge within being. like for an example it emerged into caleb. Buffy, Willow, Xander, Faith, Spike, and Ethan are all transported to the First's dimension in choas bleeds i know it didnt happen but what if?. Also
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Billie Erin
Ensouled Vampire
"I go back to December"
"I picked up a hitchhiker. You've got to when you hit them."[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,536
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Post by Billie Erin on Aug 7, 2010 15:57:55 GMT -5
I think you have some post missing buffylover
I've gotta say sorry but I agree with ruby, Caleb chose to follow the First of his own accord before it could merge with him. Angel would never choose to follow the First. If not just because he's good and it's evil, then because he knows it tried to kill Buffy and destroy the world. I just don't see Angel being the First. And besides that on one of the Q&A session threads I think someone asked if Twilight was really the First and the answer was no it's really Angel. It's a good idea but I just don't think it's possible.
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The Night Lord
Wise-cracking Sidekick
The Long Kiss Goodnight
There can be no love. Only pain exists[Mo0:1]
Posts: 2,654
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Post by The Night Lord on Aug 7, 2010 20:39:29 GMT -5
Wow, lovely covers. Dunno which one I'll get, but probably the variant. Spuffy!!! I don't have many speculations regarding this, but I will say that I am really looking forward to this and to see how it turns out and ends. Plus Spuffy
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Tea - Total
Bad Ass Wicca
?The hardest thing in this world is to ...live in it....? [Mo0:4]
Posts: 2,118
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Post by Tea - Total on Aug 8, 2010 6:45:59 GMT -5
I think you have some post missing buffyloverI've gotta say sorry but I agree with ruby, Caleb chose to follow the First of his own accord before it could merge with him. Angel would never choose to follow the First. If not just because he's good and it's evil, then because he knows it tried to kill Buffy and destroy the world. I just don't see Angel being the First. And besides that on one of the Q&A session threads I think someone asked if Twilight was really the First and the answer was no it's really Angel. It's a good idea but I just don't think it's possible. But you never know Angels back story , why did he think this? , why is he Twilight. And how did he get the super abilities of flying and superhuman strength, if the first emerged within him that could explain his new found abilities.... And the first did bring back Angel from a dimension, i know to kill Buffy , but what if that plan is still new in the first desires. You are right, i don't think it would be possible either. but what the heck.....
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Post by Skytteflickan88 on Aug 8, 2010 8:30:44 GMT -5
I thought I already had seen these covers, so I clicked on the spoilers. I heard there were new spoilerish covers, but I'm surprised it wasn't something more. Dawn could be dead or injured, and okay, that's spoilery. If Dawn dies, I hope she will in issue 37, since the cover for issue 38 gives it away. Because if I had been unspoilered, and read issue 38 and and Dawn dies in that one, I would be pissed, since the cover would already have told me that).
And doesn't Spike look happy, fighting with side by side with Buffy again? It looks like it.
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ligeia
Potential Slayer
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 192
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Post by ligeia on Aug 11, 2010 10:27:43 GMT -5
I've been thinking for a very long time now that the scythe is going to play a central role in the plot, and that the slayer spell is going to be reversed. Maybe this will happen through a time-travel, where Dawn disappear since she didn't exist then, and this would cause Xander to join forces with someone to prevent this. Question is, which "past villain" would have an interest in preventing this ?
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Post by wenxina on Aug 11, 2010 11:26:41 GMT -5
OP updated with hi-res images and official solicitation, courtesy of CBR.
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deathisyourgift
Ensouled Vampire
to read makes our speaking English good!
Timothy Dalton should win an Oscar and beat Sean Connery over the head with it!!-Andrew[Mo0:37]
Posts: 1,166
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Post by deathisyourgift on Aug 13, 2010 19:27:30 GMT -5
OMG THAT JO CHEN COVER IS RE-FRIGGIN-DICULOUSLY BEAUTIFUL AND NOW I HAVE SO MANY QUESTIONS AND OMG!!
I love you SlayAlive!! -Jen
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Neil
Potential Slayer
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Posts: 187
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Post by Neil on Aug 14, 2010 11:22:16 GMT -5
Well, I don´t know but reading "protecting the seed" I expect Buffy to be pregnant. The first time I thought that, was when Joss Whedon said, years ago, that his thought of season 9 would be, that it takes place a few years later.
I just thought. So that her child could be a little older. Than she slept with Angel and he is the only Vampire, that is able to create children. And now the seed.
I don´t know what to think about Buffy being a Mom.
Angel´s consequences for being Twilight: Maybe Connor dies. Something like that was planned in Angel After the Fall as his ultimate torture, so maybe this is his punishment.
Concerning the traitor: Maybe it´s Andrew reuniting with Warren? Warren tried to lure Andrew into his entourage ( was it in "Retreat"?)
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