Vail
Common Vampire
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 57
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Post by Vail on Oct 13, 2008 22:45:03 GMT -5
Why do you think Saga Vasuki ordered Willow to not look in the future once she crosses? I'm a little intrigued about that... It sounds a bit like Orpheus (the myth, not the Angel episode). He had to go to Hell to bring his loved one back, but he wasn't allowed to turn and see her. I'm actually more intrigued with FDW's words in #17: "What happens in your time will cause your time to come". That means that something changes after this arc. That somebody does something in the present that makes it possible for Fray's world to exist. And that somebody can only be Buffy or Willow herself. Maybe if Willow sees her future self she will take the decisions that finally turn her into FDW? Thanks Skytteflickan88 for your compliment! I can't believe that Fray's betrayed Buffy either.
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dane5by5
Wise-cracking Techno Genius
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 734
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Post by dane5by5 on Oct 14, 2008 2:19:02 GMT -5
Why do you think Saga Vasuki ordered Willow to not look in the future once she crosses? I'm a little intrigued about that... It sounds a bit like Orpheus (the myth, not the Angel episode). He had to go to Hell to bring his loved one back, but he wasn't allowed to turn and see her. I'm actually more intrigued with FDW's words in #17: "What happens in your time will cause your time to come". That means that something changes after this arc. That somebody does something in the present that makes it possible for Fray's world to exist. And that somebody can only be Buffy or Willow herself. Maybe if Willow sees her future self she will take the decisions that finally turn her into FDW? Thanks Skytteflickan88 for your compliment! I can't believe that Fray's betrayed Buffy either. I knew that scene with Willow and Saga Vasuki reminded me of something, it was vaguely familiar although I couldn't place it. Now that you've mentioned it, that entire scene seems to be an allegory of Orpheus travelling to the underworld. With Willow as Orpheus, Saga Vasuki as Hades and Persephone and Buffy as Eurydice. Willow wants to retrieve Buffy, so with Kennedy's advice, she travels to Saga Vasuki, who gives Willow the information which will allow her to save Buffy but on a condition that she can't look back (into the future) but gives no reason, only that she said. I have the feeling Willow is going to look into the future and disobey Saga Vasuki, which I don't think will leave Buffy stranded in the future, but something bad will then befall Willow. Regarding FDW's line "What happens in your time will cause your time to come" made me immediately think that because Buffy has seen the future, and Willow may possibly see what happens to herself in said future, their actions because of that knowledge will assure that it comes to pass. Whatever Buffy and Willow do after this arc, which I have a feeling will involve them trying to change the future, will actually result in Fray's world. Which, if this is how it unfolds, will be an amazing story, very complex and very bleak, considering they create this almost Slayerless future. I have no problem believing that Fray would betray Buffy. She hardly seems like the trusting kind, look what she did to her mentor at the end of the miniseries! She has no problem with betrayal, if it benefits her cause. And I'm sure FDW knows exactly what to show her, to make her see things her way. And issue 19 is still a month away. It's going to be a long month.
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rmw
Potential Slayer
I touch the fire and it freezes me[Mo0:25]
Posts: 102
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Post by rmw on Oct 16, 2008 18:00:48 GMT -5
I have a thought about FDW, and whether or not she is really evil in the future. In the television series, Buffy made numerous sacrifices in her role as slayer. She stabbed Angel, stabbed Anya, alienated friends at times, and even worked at DoubleMeat Palace (I really disliked that storyline, but I digress). Xander also made sacrifices. He offered himself to be killed when Willow wanted to destroy the world, and, later, he lost an eye in battle. Willow, on the other hand, has never made a true personal sacrifice in her Scooby service. Tara died, but that was not a conscious sacrifice on Willow's part. Instead, Willow’s history shows she simply tries to fix things quickly with magic. Perhaps, in Season 8, we are seeing Willow making one of the biggest sacrifices of all. How ironic would it be if her character, who so often wants to fix things quickly, might have had to live 200 years to right a wrong. Whoa, that's deep. Can't wait to see how it all plays out. Come on November!
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effy
Innocent Bystander
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 18
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Post by effy on Oct 20, 2008 8:20:22 GMT -5
Hey! I was re-reading this issue (still a month till part 4 grrrrr...). In the last page, when Fray's saying "Saving the world", it seems like she has a strange green light behind her back. And I'm pretty sure that's the same green color of FDW's mojo. Any hint about it? Like: Body-changing sort of thin or dude that's just Haddyn's light color? I think it's just the light from outside glowing on her back. cause remember Haddyn is like very bright!
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Post by Tyler Austin "tiewashere" on Oct 29, 2008 17:56:47 GMT -5
Why do you think Saga Vasuki ordered Willow to not look in the future once she crosses? I'm a little intrigued about that... Because she'd be able to see what she has become in the future. Or do you mean the less obvious reason? Like maybe if she sees herself dark she would try to prevent it and Saga wants it turn out that way?
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anneke
Innocent Bystander
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 4
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Post by anneke on Nov 21, 2008 10:35:23 GMT -5
"That spin’s for govvers, not slayers. Something’s skew with that girl.”
Is "govvers" another futuristic-slang word? What does it mean?
Sorry for this stupid question, but I'm Italian, this arc is really confusing for non-english readers!
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Slayer489
Wise-cracking Techno Genius
"Why do I feel like this? Why do I let Spike do those things to me?" - Buffy 'Dead Things'[Mo0:0]
Posts: 784
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Post by Slayer489 on Nov 21, 2008 13:18:58 GMT -5
"That spin’s for govvers, not slayers. Something’s skew with that girl.” Is "govvers" another futuristic-slang word? What does it mean? Sorry for this stupid question, but I'm Italian, this arc is really confusing for non-english readers! Don't worry it's hard for us too. I think govver's might be a futuristic word...see even I'm not certain. I think this has been the weakest arc yet, not just because of the language, because I understand that times change. I hope part 4 makes up for it.
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Post by Emmie on Nov 21, 2008 17:01:13 GMT -5
"That's spin for govvers, not slayers."
I took "govvers" to be a derivation of "governers". So Fray is saying that the 'big picture' outlook Buffy has is more for politicians than slayers.
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Post by Rebecca on Nov 23, 2008 17:21:04 GMT -5
"That's spin for govvers, not slayers." I took "govvers" to be a derivation of "governers". So Fray is saying that the 'big picture' outlook Buffy has is more for politicians than slayers. Agreed. Perhaps everyone would like the TOYL arc better if they understood what Fray was saying. That being said, to everyone still confused about Fray-speak, please post questions. It should help you to enjoy the arc better. _____________ I am more convinced now that Willow is the betrayer from "Anywhere But Here". Issue 18, Page 7: Harth to FDW: "I remember fighting you. In the dream you hurt me. Not just fighting--you're connected to someone I love. And that's the one, the slayer of slayers. That's who I am in the dream. That's who's coming." I just imagine that scene in ABH with Buffy bleeding and crying on the floor and the mention of the betrayer. I think this fight Harth is speaking of will take place in a future issue, in that it is not from S6. Also, FDW calls Buffy the Princess. Does that make Xander the Prince who she has to save?
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Post by Emmie on Nov 23, 2008 18:34:19 GMT -5
Touched, it makes me wonder if someone should make a Fray dictionary for the ToYL readers... *considers doing that*
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Post by Rebecca on Nov 23, 2008 20:30:42 GMT -5
Touched, it makes me wonder if someone should make a Fray dictionary for the ToYL readers... *considers doing that* I've already started Toy: bad Spin: lie Half-coi?? Cen: century Lurk: Vampire Ock?? Laws: police Spled: good Cert: certain Hokum?? Ridiculous? Connex: connection Uppers: upper level of Haddyn, where the rich people live Jesu: God Govvers: politicians Skew: wrong
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