Enisy
Descendant of a Toaster Oven
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 643
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Post by Enisy on Dec 10, 2008 19:11:37 GMT -5
I appreciate that you didn't immediately assume that he would be on Spike's side, even tough you say he likes Spike more(I haven't read/heard the interview you speak of). It's the one quoted above. "He's a character that I always liked a little bit more than Angel because..." -- "He's got more of an edge." -- "He was more evolved, though. He had more of an edge, but at the same time, you know, he chose to have a soul." Agree, but considering Joss's general sympathy for underdogs, I'm thinking he was more attuned to the Spike side of things in episodes like Destiny. (Not so much in Chosen, because, as the writer, he had to view the events from every character's point of view: Spike's and Angel's and Buffy's. He said as much in a related interview.) His preference of Spike over Angel doesn't necessarily also indicate a preference for Spike/Buffy over Angel/Buffy, but it definitely indicates that he at least sees the merit of the 'ship (since the Spike he likes is the "wanted to give you what you deserve" version, not the 2.5-dimensional villain so popular with Angel/Buffy and Spike/Drusilla fans).
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Post by Emmie on Dec 10, 2008 19:13:55 GMT -5
What interests me about that Joss Whedon interview, by the way, is... if he likes Spike better than Angel, then who was he sympathising with the most in "versus" situations, like Chosen and Destiny? In Chosen, I think it's clear that Joss tried to treat them equally. Angel got the kiss, Spike got the "I love you" - though I think Spike still got the better deal in that. A profession of love (from someone who repeatedly said they could never love him) seems more powerful than a passionate reunion kiss. I think Destiny favors Spike. Yes, at this point in Season 5 Angel is supposed to be questioning himself so Spike winning was important to shaking Angel's confidence. But the episode itself shows Spike as the sympathetic character both in the flashbacks and the present. In the past, Angelus was horribly cruel to Spike who still possessed the capability to love Drusilla devotedly. While they were both portrayed as evil monsters, Spike still was painted to be incredibly sympathetic. During the fight in the opera house, the verbal jabs they throw at each other are both vicious. But I find Spike's to be more truthful about Angel selling out and making a deal with the devil. Where as Angel's are more a malicious twist of the truth - Spike got a soul to get into Buffy's pants, Buffy never really loved Spike. What's more, I *wanted* Spike to win - I think the intent of that episode was to make the viewer want Spike to win. It was a satisfying tale of the underdog finally getting his due and stepping out of Angel's shadow. I've never gotten the past impression that Joss didn't like Spike which is why the recent interview didn't really enlighten me all that much. I always thought Spike was treated well in the series. I suspect that the fandom perception that Joss didn't like Spike comes from James Marsters stating that Joss didn't have an interest in the character. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe Joss re-wrote the end scene of Beneath You. I think that scene in itself speaks to how Joss sees Spike. As for Spike's character journey, you don't plan a redemption arc for a character that started off as a one ep Baddie if there wasn't something compelling there. I think the fact that Spike played such a huge role in the series speaks for itself of Joss' appreciation of his character.
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Post by VampSlayer on Dec 12, 2008 18:31:03 GMT -5
<3 Spuffy! In my top 5 couples! WOOOOOO! xD
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Post by CowboyGuy on Dec 14, 2008 13:33:33 GMT -5
Aww I am glad you like it! It was one of my favorite ones to make, very memorable scene and it's instantly recognizable. It's hard to make scene emoticons, but this one worked great.
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Post by ilovewillow on Dec 19, 2008 20:30:07 GMT -5
Just wanted to say those banners are sooooo good Welcome done guys!
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Post by Emmie on Dec 29, 2008 22:25:40 GMT -5
I just read this Spuffy fic and *really* enjoyed it. It's a WIP but it's still worth the read. I've read a lot of fanfiction and I rarely take the time to recommend works, but this one is great. The characterization is strong for Buffy and Spike and the concept is executed with adept skill. I liked it so much that I wrote the author hoping to encourage them to continue writing, but even if it remains a work-in-progress, it's one of the best fics I've read in a long time. And The Dream Will Set You Free by Randi10 Chapter WIP, Season 5 Re-write, PG-13, Buffy/Riley because of the circumstances of Season 5 but it's Buffy/Spike from the get-go. What if, at the end of Out of My Mind, it was Buffy who woke up from a dream?
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Enisy
Descendant of a Toaster Oven
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 643
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Post by Enisy on Jan 6, 2009 15:24:48 GMT -5
Lookit the song that Buffy's listening to in the Spike/Buffy Breakup Episode ( As You Were)... This is peace and I know 'cause I'm too tired to cry I'll never get close to you and I'm just too distracted to try Pain is a rain that washes away I'm a fabric you can't stain To fall into this is not what I want So understand me if I don't Love is a glove that just doesn't fit No matter how you pull at it To make light of you Is all that I have So understand me if I laugh It is late I won't ask you to stay or to stroke I have never gotten warm from you huddling close If you danced I might take you right up in my arms But you don't So I whisper this is all This is allAw. Also, look what the amazing Aryal sent me for my Spike/Buffy VIP Quoteslist. I hadn't seen these before: What's your favourite episode?I used to answer that question as whenever I was either kissing Buffy or kicking her. 'Cause you know you're in the middle of things when one of those two things are happening! -- James Marsters (Gen Con 2001 Q&A, August 5th 2001)Love scenes are really kinda problematic for actors because we have girlfriends and your partner has a relationship as well. So, I can joke on about how, "Hey, this is Sarah, this is gonna be cool," but she has a fiance, who will kick my ass! I mean, if someone talked about my fiancee that way...! With all respect to Fred... it was just another day! (innocent look on face) -- James Marsters (Gen Con 2001 Q&A, August 5th 2001)I think it's good to have Spike and Dawn together, because it shows Spike's mindset. Which is that anyone who Buffy loves is very important. So, he will protect anyone Buffy loves. Don't hurt Buffy. Don't hurt anyone that's important to her. Keep them safe. -- James Marsters (Gen Con 2001 Q&A, August 5th 2001)As previously reported, Faith will be turning up in both LA and Sunnydale in Season Seven. So will this lead to a crossover between the two shows and any of the main characters? James emphatically channels Spike's response to the idea of Buffy and Angel reuniting: "No. No. No!" ( Buffy Magazine, January 2003) We've seen so much response to the relationship Buffy had with Spike and [the dark magic] with Willow, I don't know if we stopped to think these storylines would be going on at the same time. -- Marti Noxon (Buffy Magazine, January 2003)The only thing I can say about the finale is that it's going to be really bloody and really romantic, and heartbreaking - we hope. We hope to break your hearts. -- James Marsters (TV Zone, May 2003)What do you hope fans will make of the finale?I hope it was really romantic and heartbreaking. -- James Marsters (SFX, July 2003)The end of the season will be very romantic, and that's all I can say. For my character and for Buffy. The Buffy-Spike thing is going to end very romantically and very dramatically. -- James MarstersJames said that at one point he’d asked Joss if subconsciously he’d written the Buffy/Riley relationship in such a way that it left things really open for Spike. Joss replied in a very sarcastic tone that maybe he had "unconciously". -- Fan Report (The Harsh Light of Day Commentary at James Marsters and Friends, conducted by James Marsters, Jane Espenson and Mercedes McNab, September 2006)Jane said that for years she had a notecard on her desk that said "Buffy has sex dreams about Spike" which she wanted to point out to people when Joss did decide to put Spike and Buffy together. -- Fan Report (The Harsh Light of Day Commentary at James Marsters and Friends, conducted by James Marsters, Jane Espenson and Mercedes McNab, September 2006)James said he was ahead on that one too and had just spoken to David (Fury) about this as he hadn’t liked the chip he wanted to see the character choose to try to be good instead. If they kept Spike a villain he became ineffective but if he tried to be good and failed it was more interesting and Spike falling in love with Buffy did that. Though in his mind Spike would fail and go back to being evil. Jane said the chip was needed to keep Spike on a leash for a while so people would buy Buffy having a relationship with him in the first place. James never thought that Buffy would get into a relationship with Spike. Jane talked about how important it was to get both characters to that place where it could work. -- Fan Report (The Harsh Light of Day Commentary at James Marsters and Friends, conducted by James Marsters, Jane Espenson and Mercedes McNab, September 2006)
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Post by Greer on Jan 6, 2009 19:05:21 GMT -5
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Renée
Descendant of a Toaster Oven
Spike's Petite Cr?me Br?l?e
"It won't hurt much longer and then you'll be where I am. We'll be together."[Mo0:31]
Posts: 609
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Post by Renée on Jan 7, 2009 12:43:40 GMT -5
I have a love/hate relationship with Spuffy. I like what it did for Spike, he became a better being. Buffy on the other hand, not so much. I don't think they're cute together, and I highly doubt they'll ever get back together in the future of Season 8, 9 and beyond. One very poignant minute for me is the: "I know you'll never love me, I know I'm a monster...but you treat me like a man" I really liked that part, and in some ways wish that Spike had never gone to get a soul, it cheapens it for me. Couldn't agree more with you
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AndrewForever
Innocent Bystander
So no more running. I aim to misbehave.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 29
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Post by AndrewForever on Jan 9, 2009 17:31:05 GMT -5
Which season did you like Spike/Buffy best in?The second half of season 5, the first half of season 6, and the second half of season 7. Which is your favourite Spike/Buffy episode?"Chosen", "Fool for Love", "The Gift" What are their top 3 (or 5) most romantic scenes?1. Bed sharing in "Touched" 2. Burning hands in "Chosen" 3. "Every night I save you" in "After Life" 4. Kiss in "Once More With Feeling" 5. Kiss in "Intervention" What would you like to see in their inevitable Season 8 reunion?The look an Buffy's face when she sees him. Who do you like better: Spike or Buffy?Spike
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Enisy
Descendant of a Toaster Oven
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 643
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Post by Enisy on Jan 20, 2009 8:50:03 GMT -5
*tacklehugs greer, Renee and AndrewForever* If you haven't seen it yet, go check out this meta by the incredible Maggie: Spike and Season 8 ( "It's not so obvious to me that Spike isn't going to play a role in Season 8 ..."). It's got 117 comments so far, and for good reason. Jeff Sharlet also blogged on Spike and Spike/Buffy yesterday. And I have a couple of ficrecs: In Absentia by ErinyaPairing/Characters: Spike/Buffy, Spike/Illyria friendship Rating: PG Summary: He wouldn't have come to Rome, except that she was dead. Post-"Chosen", post-"Not Fade Away", integrates current "Buffy Season 8", "Spike: After the Fall" and "Angel: After the Fall" canon to some extent. (And chapter 2 here.) As I'm Leaving by HeatherSummary: Helping the Gang finally proves interesting for Spike when he steals a device that causes him to go wherever, whenever... but he's not as in control as he thought. Set after "The Gift" and then a free-for-all with timelines and happenings. Rating: R Also, I was discussing this on another forum: Spike/Buffy is really the only 100% canon Spike-centric 'ship we're likely to ever get, isn't it? 'Cause Joss isn't writing or mapping out or overseeing Angel: Aftermath (his name isn't even on the cover), and even Angel: After the Fall isn't quite as Joss-approved as Season 8. Jeffrey Berman: Do you think about it in terms of seasons? Joss Whedon: I do. I do. Season 8 will be 40 issues long; I know what Season 9 is about, it's very different from Season 8. Jeffrey Berman: 40? Joss Whedon: Yes. Jeffrey Berman: Wow. Same thing with "Angel"? Joss Whedon: The "Angel" thing is different. The "Angel" thing, they just, you know, they had a good writer, Brian Lynch, who had done a thing I admired, so I said, look, I can tell you where we were going with Season 6... You can't call it Season 6, because "Buffy" actually is Season 8, I'm literally executive producing the comic book. Jeffrey Berman: I see. Joss Whedon: I'm going through every script, I'm going through every sketch, I'm going through... I'm doing the job. On "Angel", I'll tell you basically what we had in mind, give you some ideas, and Brian and I went back and forth on a few things, then I just said "Good luck!" ( from The Write Environment DVD) Now how about that Season 8 Spike/Buffy reunion...
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spikesgirl
Common Vampire
This is the crack team that foils my every plan? I am *deeply* shamed. [Mo0:16]
Posts: 50
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Post by spikesgirl on Jan 21, 2009 7:35:21 GMT -5
Which season did you like Spike/Buffy best in? 2nd half of the 7th season Which is your favorite Spike/Buffy episode? touched What are their top 3 (or 5) most romantic scenes? 1.touched 2.the kiss Buffy gives for not telling glory about dawn 3.afterlife What would you like to see in their inevitable Season 8 reunion? what their first words are to each other Who do you like better: Spike or Buffy? spike
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Post by Emmie on Jan 30, 2009 16:05:08 GMT -5
Here are some Spuffy thoughts I posted on Rahirah's Live Journal that might generate some more discussion: I've been coming to better understand Buffy's character in light of how hard it is for her to connect to others (after all the tragedies and loss she's suffered over the years) and that she's basically locked up her heart and doesn't open it up to new people (she only says "I love you" to the Core and Dawn who was hardwired into her heart and mind). That her love is "blinding" and that's why she pulls away from it. It became harder and harder for her to say "I love you" starting in Season 5 and I think she's afraid of the tragedy and pain that comes from admitting that she loves someone, thereby loving them fully and openly leading to immense pain at losing them. She loved Angel in that way --- tragedy and pain. She loved her mom --- tragedy and pain. She loved Dawn that openly in Season 5 and Dawn constantly being in peril led to Buffy going into a catatonic state and even threatening to renounce her duties as slayer, even let the world end to protect Dawn. And arguably, her love for Dawn led to her giving up her own life in order to save her. Love that powerful is frightening and that's how Buffy loves - she loves "with all of [her] soul. It's brighter than the fire ... blinding. That's why you pull away from it." Her love overcomes her entire being. I actually see Buffy referring to her love for Spike throughout Season 7 but just not being able to admit it openly because she has to deny her love or else she's opening herself to the pain of losing her loved one. "Love is pain" and Buffy continues to fear that pain. Moments like "why does everyone think I'm still in love with Spike?" to her telling Angel Spike was "in [her] heart" - a vague euphemism that essentially means she loves him. The heart is emotionally symbolic of love - what other interpretation does this statement give us but that Buffy *does* love Spike but is afraid to admit it? Only when Spike is sacrificing his life does she find the courage to admit her feelings because 1) it's her last chance 2) Spike needs to know how she really feels and 3) his courageous sacrifice in turn inspires her to be brave. Looking at the Spuffy story of Season 6 and 7, I see it as a tale of Buffy denying love or even the ability to love someone. Yet Spike continues to fight for her affection and in the end, she finally overcomes her fears to admit her feelings. The tragedy is that it's too little, too late. But it was real and it was a hard-won moment. I think the sad thing was that Spike didn't believe her in the end. She had protested so much that he finally came to the conclusion he wasn't worthy of her love. Their relationship was never easy, even to the very end. If that is the end. I'll admit I think Spike didn't believe her when she said "I love you." I think the way he acts during AtS season 5 confirms that too. He even tells Angel that Buffy never loved him and that he doesn't think he has a chance with her. I find their relationship always took the more difficult and complex route. The great romance moniker would more readily fit Buffy/Angel in a simplistic sense. With Buffy and Spike it's always felt more like an uphill battle against circumstances caused by each person's inner hangups. Buffy's fear of opening her heart to Spike, what that says about her own inner darkness and the potential for pain afterwards. Spike's battle with his inner demon, his struggle to be worthy and his desire for love. I find beautiful symmetry in Spike chasing Buffy for love and her running away, only to stop pursuing her when he gets a soul. Once he stops the chase, Buffy becomes the initiator of emotional support, no longer running but slowly building trust and the ability to declare herself. They're always chasing each other or avoiding each other. Fear and desire. It's a wonderful follow-up to the Buffy/Angel tortured love story of loving each other so much but outside forces ultimately conspiring to keep them apart. With Buffy and Spike, it's their own inner hangups. When Buffy finally finds the courage to open her heart to him, it's now Spike who is too afraid, too guilty, feeling too unworthy to meet her. It truly is a dance. A tango. Spike advances, Buffy retreats. Buffy advances, Spike retreats. It's part of why I feel their story hasn't ended where as Buffy/Angel feels like it's indefinitely on hold. Buffy/Spike feels more like an interlude before the dance begins again. But that's my hopeful side rearing its overly optimistic head. Or at least it feels that way in the fandom.
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Post by Emmie on Feb 14, 2009 15:36:51 GMT -5
♥♥ HAPPY VALENTINE'S DAY SPUFFY LOVERS! ♥♥
Also a Wallpaper Version (Click to Enlarge):
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Kara
Bad Ass Wicca
boys boys boys
[Mo0:28]
Posts: 2,296
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Post by Kara on Feb 14, 2009 16:12:19 GMT -5
LMFAO. OMG cuuuuuuuuuuuuuute<3
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Post by Emmie on Feb 14, 2009 16:40:34 GMT -5
The Tale of Spuffy Love in Emoticons Vampires and demons were preying on innocent and oddly orange people. So a Slayer was called to defeat them. Her name was Buffy. Her friends, Xander and Willow, and her Watcher, Giles, helped her in the fight against evil. She even fell in love with a vampire with a soul - it ended badly. During all this emotional angst, a much cooler vampire appeared in Sunnydale. Buffy was worried at first because Spike had a reputation for killing Slayers. But Buffy defeated Spike time and again. The repeated failures pissed Spike off and he became obsessed with defeating Buffy. Buffy wasn't impressed by his efforts to take her down. Spike got chipped. He didn't like it. And he blamed this guy. Buffy found Spike even more lame as a neutered vampire. Especially when she found out that Spike had fallen in love with her. After Buffy came back from the dead, she found she could only turn to Spike. ;D At first, it made Spike happy. Sex, lots of sex, was good. And bad sometimes too in the fun and naughty way. But extreme emotional badness ensued. Spike realized that he couldn't be a monster or a man, so he went off to get a soul. This freaked Buffy out at first, but she eventually tried to help him on his new path. She kept telling him she believed in him. And he returned the favor by showing her how to believe in herself because she's "the one." Which helped Buffy slay evil. Sidebar: The other souled vampire wasn't happy to learn that Spike had a soul now, too. Spike wasn't happy to learn that Buffy was saying hello to the other vampire with her tongue. Well, doing more than saying hello with her tongue, if you know what I mean. But Buffy reassured Spike that she still believed in him and even gave him a piece of jewelry from the Elizabeth Taylor collection to prove it. And together, they seriously kicked evil ass. With Willow's help, too, of course. And their victory led to fiery, handholding love and Spike sacrificing his life to save the world. And seeing them victorious over evil (largely thanks to Spike), Buffy smiles. -THE END- ...or not. SPOILERS Season 8 Preview: Buffy dreams about a threesome with her vampire lovers.
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moscowwatcher
Potential Slayer
You're the one, Buffy[Mo0:0]
Posts: 106
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Post by moscowwatcher on Feb 15, 2009 2:51:48 GMT -5
Emmie, it was a great story! THE END... or not.We'll see.
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Post by Greer on Feb 15, 2009 14:23:20 GMT -5
Emmie, both of those things were AMAZING! I love them!!!
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Post by Emmie on Feb 15, 2009 15:12:02 GMT -5
Thanks Greer and Moscow!
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Enisy
Descendant of a Toaster Oven
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 643
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Post by Enisy on Feb 20, 2009 9:48:27 GMT -5
Emmie, as I told you elsewhere, these are just the cutest things ever. For anyone who hasn't seen it, this is from stormwreath's transcript of the new Joss Whedon Q&A: Question: Speaking of the second half [of Season 8], will we see an actual Buffy/Angel reunion and/or a reaffirmation of their romantic feelings?Joss Whedon: They're going to have sex for three issues straight. Nothing but porn. And that's what America needs. Question: Will Buffy ever know that Spike is alive?Joss Whedon: Spike will appear in two of the three issues. I can't really describe how. No, all of these things, you know, all of these characters we have licence to use in the Buffyverse but because a different company has the franchise we've been a little hands-off. But, you know, we've got so much to play with right now that we're waiting; but we won't wait forever. Got to see our boys. (Also, you can send more questions for Joss in at Hulu until Wednesday.) Questions: Will you keep 'shipping Spike/Buffy if it's made clear in the text that it's still one-sided?
Do you think Angel and Spike will show up in different Season 8 issues, or in the same one?
Are there any other Whedonverse 'ships that remind you of Spike/Buffy?
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