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Post by jessesopher on Aug 25, 2008 8:49:01 GMT -5
I was thinking about this this morning....
Why was Spike brought back to Angel for season 5? I'm not a Spike fan at all (I can't stand him, really), but even I loved his exit... his death. His 'final' words were epic "I want to see how it ends."
It was a perfect ending for a character that most people liked. Why ruin that by bringing him back?
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Post by Skytteflickan88 on Aug 25, 2008 8:54:18 GMT -5
Well he was/is very popular. Perhaps he was brought back for ratings. Perhaps with Connor and Cordy gone, Joss needed another character. Joss might also have thought that it would be interesting to be able to compare the two souled vampires, which I thought was a big theme in season 5.
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stakey
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Post by stakey on Aug 25, 2008 9:03:51 GMT -5
im pretty certain it was the network who requested joss bring Spike back.
It was uncertain as to whether Angel would be renewed for a fifth season hence the open endedness of season 4 finale Home...it was meant to be a mini pilot for what season 5 would be like.
And I think the network said to joss bring Spike back for season 5 to try and get more viewers as Spike was massively popular in Buffy.
I hope this decision didnt factor in the getting rid of cordelia, because I think a main reason to getting rid of charisma was money issues and bringing Marsters in they had to cut Charisma out. yeh there was the whole prenancy issue but I think it would have been wise to bring her back mid season 5 and keep her but i dont think they could actually afford it.
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Post by henzINNIT on Aug 25, 2008 10:24:22 GMT -5
He returned to ensure Angel's 5th season. Worthy sacrifice I think. If he wasn't in Angel, he may have been in a Faith spin-off. Spike resting in peace was never on the cards the poor bastard.
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Post by buffyfan21 on Aug 25, 2008 21:55:45 GMT -5
I loved the fact that Spike joined the ranks in S5, it is my fave season (and no, not just b/c of Spike). I loved seeing the dynamic between those two. And the way they would always bicker at each other was just hilarious to me.
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Post by Jsebold87 on Aug 25, 2008 22:22:28 GMT -5
I loved the fact that Spike joined the ranks in S5, it is my fave season (and no, not just b/c of Spike). I loved seeing the dynamic between those two. And the way they would always bicker at each other was just hilarious to me. That's the same way I feel about season 5. David and James together is always hilarious. |
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Post by Angelsgirl on Aug 26, 2008 3:44:12 GMT -5
Bringing Spike back was a good decision in my books. They tied it very well into the story line and he was sooo funny on the show. Season 5 of Angel is probably the only time when I really really like Spike...I didn't really think much of him during Buffy but he was fab in Angel.
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Rachster
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Post by Rachster on Aug 26, 2008 3:54:39 GMT -5
I think bringing spike back was a great choice, alot of why i love S5 was spike and angel together. :broody: :moody:
"Spike? spike, blondy bear?!"
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barryshaft
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Post by barryshaft on Aug 26, 2008 23:46:06 GMT -5
I definately recall back when Buffy was ending that it was already very apparent that Spike would be continuing in some form. There was talk of both his joining Angel and of being central on the Faith on a Motorcycle Kung-Fu series that was being pitched around that time.
I definately knew he wasn't staying dead watching Chosen. It's still a very powerful scene for the character but I'm glad he came back on Angel, Spike's character isn't the martyr type and he finally got the chance to grow into his hero role on Angel as he was given much more to do then brood in a basement. During his final season of Buffy he was essentially an Angel in the making, brooding and feeling bad for himself, but on Angel he really did become his own character that recaptured a lot of the spirit of what made him so interesting to begin with.
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Enisy
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Post by Enisy on Aug 29, 2008 7:24:34 GMT -5
James Marsters: [Joss said to me, right after we shot Beneath You] "...we have no idea what to do with you for this year. The only thing we know we want to do with is we want to kill you." Then he said, "But (laughs) I don't want you to remain dead. I want to bring you back." So, the whole year on Buffy was all about experimenting with different ways to continue the storytelling with this universe. (L.A. Press Junket, 2-04)*shrugs* I hope this decision didnt factor in the getting rid of cordelia, because I think a main reason to getting rid of charisma was money issues and bringing Marsters in they had to cut Charisma out. yeh there was the whole prenancy issue but I think it would have been wise to bring her back mid season 5 and keep her but i dont think they could actually afford it. Some are speculating that she was a casualty of James Marsters's cross over as Spike next season. Like, there wasn't enough money in the budget to pay for them both, so she got the boot. Joss Whedon: That's a hell of a thing to lay on James. It was a creative decision that we made before Spike came over to the show, and like I said, I don't intend to leave Cordelia in a coma for the rest of the Buffyverse. But the creative decision to have the character step down happened long before negotiations with James [started]. It should not be laid at his feet.
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Post by Tyler Austin "tiewashere" on Sept 2, 2008 1:27:01 GMT -5
The only reason Angel got a season 5 and the WB let them was if they put Spike on. That's what happened or what I have been told happened and why Spike is there serving no purpose at all.
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Enisy
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Post by Enisy on Sept 2, 2008 3:48:58 GMT -5
"No purpose at all"? He was pretty obviously Angel's doppelganger in a season where his (Angel's) character was at his most controversial.
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witcher
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Post by witcher on Sept 3, 2008 15:13:41 GMT -5
I loved Angel-Spike chemistry in season 5, but it kinda ruined his death, and it was a great death. They should have just put Faith and Cordelia in the mix and be done with it!
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brandonr
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Post by brandonr on Sept 3, 2008 17:11:18 GMT -5
I liked Spike in AS5 very much. I thought he provided a great catalyst for Angel, and a definite mirror for Angel to look into to see just how far he'd gone in the wrong direction by working with Wolfram & Hart. Not to mention that we would've never had "Hell Bound" if it weren't for Spike and his incorporealness--which, I think was one of the scariest episodes of either Buffy or Angel.
What I definitely wouldn't have wanted to happen would for Spike to go along with Faith to her proposed show. While they had good chemistry in the basement of Buffy's house, I don't think he would've been the right fit for Faith, even if they were on the same wavelength about a lot of things. Faith needed to step away from the "Buffy" of it, and she didn't need a brooding vampire sidekick, no matter how different Angel and Spike may be.
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ded1
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Post by ded1 on Sept 3, 2008 17:32:20 GMT -5
James Marsters: [Joss said to me, right after we shot Beneath You] "...we have no idea what to do with you for this year. The only thing we know we want to do with is we want to kill you." Then he said, "But (laughs) I don't want you to remain dead. I want to bring you back." So, the whole year on Buffy was all about experimenting with different ways to continue the storytelling with this universe. (L.A. Press Junket, 2-04) That could explain why Spike sucked in season 7 IMO I liked Spike in season 5 of Angel.JM and DB work well together |
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Enisy
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Post by Enisy on Sept 3, 2008 18:10:09 GMT -5
And even with his "no idea what to do with you this year" predicament, Spike got more of a storyline than any other cast member besides Buffy did in Season 7. Makes you wonder what the writers were doing all year.
I loved Spike in Season 5 of Angel -- not as much as I did in Seasons 5-6 of Buffy, but still loved him. My only issue was the change in James's accent, but I've moved past that in recent months.
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balesthebloody
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Post by balesthebloody on Sept 3, 2008 20:49:07 GMT -5
Spike in "Angel" Season 5 was more than just for ratings. Spike's story wasn't finished yet, still isn't, IMO.
Spike dying in "Chosen" was an awesome death, perfect, but not for Spike. Spike did a lot of bad things in his past, and letting him off that easy? Not by a long shot. Spike was happy dead, and as we all know, people in the Buffyvesre don't get to be happy.
Spike, I feel, was sent back for a reason, other than the ones stated on the show. Spike, once back, let Angel know how far off the beaten path he had gone. Spike was like Angel's angel.
Spike also grew a lot during the season. He also did some good in L.A. And now we know that without Spike, Illyria wouldn't have made it in Hell.A.
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Post by jessesopher on Sept 3, 2008 22:27:33 GMT -5
The only time I really liked spike was in season 2 when he first appeared. He and Dru were great villains, but he should have been staked a long time ago. I mean, really, why didn't they stake him when he had the chip before the soul... I hated the "he's harmless" crap.
But Spike WAS actually tolerable in season 5... still as annoying as ever, but more tolerable than he had been on Buffy.
I guess I just don't like that his death was PERFECT... that was the PERFECT death (whether for Spike or not) and it was wasted.
Meh.
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Post by Skytteflickan88 on Sept 17, 2008 7:20:10 GMT -5
The only time I really liked spike was in season 2 when he first appeared. He and Dru were great villains, but he should have been staked a long time ago. I mean, really, why didn't they stake him when he had the chip before the soul... I hated the "he's harmless" crap. I hear you. That was a stupid descision of the characters. I would atleast expect Giles to be ruthless enough to see the obvious, that if Spike loses his chip, he's dangerous again. And as seen, Spike could cause trouble with the chip. He could kill Angel, work with Adam and in season 6 he stole those eggs in the Riley-episode. If Giles could kill Ben, why not Spike? A poor descision by Joss. Sure, Spike added to the show, but he took away from the other characters, by making them go to easy on Spike. I wouldn't expect Xander and Willow to do the staking, but Buffy & Giles should have staked him. |
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Post by jessesopher on Sept 17, 2008 7:36:03 GMT -5
The only time I really liked spike was in season 2 when he first appeared. He and Dru were great villains, but he should have been staked a long time ago. I mean, really, why didn't they stake him when he had the chip before the soul... I hated the "he's harmless" crap. I hear you. That was a stupid descision of the characters. I would atleast expect Giles to be ruthless enough to see the obvious, that if Spike loses his chip, he's dangerous again. And as seen, Spike could cause trouble with the chip. He could kill Angel, work with Adam and in season 6 he stole those eggs in the Riley-episode. If Giles could kill Ben, why not Spike? A poor descision by Joss. Sure, Spike added to the show, but he took away from the other characters, by making them go to easy on Spike. I wouldn't expect Xander and Willow to do the staking, but Buffy & Giles should have staked him. I know. It's so obvious that the only reason Spike was there was for fanservice. He really served no purpose.... But I agree with what you're saying. Buffy/The Scooby Gang's inability to stake him really made me lose some respect for the Scoobies. I dunno. It just doesn't make sense to me, storywise, why he's still alive... |
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