BenTaylor3907
Wise-cracking Sidekick
Illyria's Qwa'ha Xahn
~ Listening To Fear ~[Mo0:25]
Posts: 2,958
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Post by BenTaylor3907 on Sept 14, 2009 14:46:39 GMT -5
I'm right there with you about the spelling/grammar errors. It's getting better, and I only have myself to blame, but yeah, every time one makes it in it kills me. No biggie, it happens. Most of us just look past it. Right guys? Guys?
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Post by Emmie on Sept 14, 2009 14:59:50 GMT -5
Some errors from BUFFY and ANGEL were fixed, some weren't. For me, IDW's hardcovers are gush-worthy and Dark Horse's BUFFY TPBs are good as well. Physically good, the extras are not so much. I can also say that Dark Horse makes a good hardcover, as I have "The Long Way Home" in HC. Not IDW status, because still no extras, but it's a damn nice volume. I wish they did the rest of the series that way. Well, they're TPBs and not HCs so they're not really meant to include extras. And it's been my understanding that there aren't extras yet from DH because the story isn't finished yet. They're working on finishing the product before pulling back the curtain and going "look at all the cool stuff y'all can see behind-the-scenes!" That's what the Deluxe edition will be for when Season 8 is finished. Seems to me the progression goes: - Individual issues for people who want it right away and who also want to buy variant covers - TPBs for people who want the story in larger, readable chunks without ads interrupting - Deluxe Edition HCs of the entire storyline, including extras (interviews, scripts, covers, etc.) I personally don't need the uber fancy hard covers until after the story is finished. It'd be like watching the DVD commentary for Lessons before Chosen even airs on TV. It's hard to thoughtfully comment on the story when the story isn't even finished. Side note: I know IDW's HC's are (for the most part barring ink stains, spine issues) very nice, but it kinda feels like when some writers switch to HC's after they've always been publishing paperbacks. I'm just a bit puzzled because the many people that wanted to buy the TPB's of After the Fall bought the hardcovers instead. It's a marketing choice. But it seems odd to me to completely bypass the TPB stage for After the Fall. The TPBs for After the Fall are only now being released - Volume 2 doesn't even come out til November. Why are extras in the hardcovers being prioritized over ease in reading of the TPBs? It's that inverse relationship where readers buy hardcovers for a longer lasting piece, something to save and that will endure. But the reader wants to actually read it first before chipping in for the added cost of the hardcovers. Paul, I've gotta say it does irk me a little bit to see the HC Aftermath being reviewed to on the cover as "Volume 5". They're clearly working hard to link it to After the Fall. So much so that TFAW accidentally calls Aftermath "After the Fall Vol 5" on the sales page.
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jellymoff
Ensouled Vampire
Claimer of Funn[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,174
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Post by jellymoff on Sept 14, 2009 16:37:31 GMT -5
To speak on Emmie's comment about Hardcovers-Marvel and DC are staring to do this now as well in many cases. You will see the individuals issues come out, then a "Premier Hardcover", followed by a TPB months later. I find it seriously annoying, because for many of these series I don't care to own a hardcover. With Angel, I knew I would get hardcovers regardless but for other comics that I care less about, it keeps me from buying them.
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Post by Wyndam on Sept 14, 2009 16:42:48 GMT -5
TPB's first, HC's first, either way it is a lose lose because people want different things. I prefer HC's over TPB's any day, and most of the comics that I do buy, I buy in HC format, if it is available. So the waiting game for HC's, when I prefer them to TPB's, would be unbearable, just like it is with people that only want TPB's and have to wait for them. That's why I don't buy the Buffy TPB's. I know HC's are coming eventually, so why would I waste my money?
So, like I said, it's a lose lose because people just prefer different things. While Single issues -> TPB -> HC may be the norm, it isn't the ideal norm, for me, so I certainly don't agree with the assessment that that is the best way to handle releases.
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Post by Emmie on Sept 14, 2009 16:57:05 GMT -5
The HC movement is extremely annoying (I'm mostly speaking to the trend outside of the comics). There are certain authors who I've enjoyed and gladly buy a paperback, but they aren't worth buying the HC for. So when they switch to HC and make me wait 6 months for the paperback because I refuse to spend $20 on the book...ugh, I definitely see how HC can be a deterrent to buyers. And then when you factor in that the cost of two volumes of After the Fall are equal to the cost of one televised season (sometimes less if you find a sale), it all starts to add up.
I was talking with this kid at my comic store while I was waiting in line and apparently he spends upwards of $200-300 on comics every month. Um, no. I don't want to be doing that. It's sadly what it feels like being led into, though, with the IDW spinoffs.
It's weird, but I almost feel like a "bad" fan for not supporting certain endeavors. Like the "Not Fade Away" and "Smile Time" comics - I don't see the point. I've even paged through them, but really if I want to relive those stories, I'll go watch the DVDs. I'm working through "Blood & Trenches" and finding it enjoyable, while a bit jarring for characterization reasons. "Aftermath" was a wash for me. I enjoyed the first part of "Drusilla", though honestly there was more substance in the art than the story and I'm hoping the second issue delivers. I kept wondering - when does the story start...? And the preview for the second part didn't really reassure (though Lynch remarked on those pages not being the best choice for a preview). I'm looking forward to the funny Angel issues ahead by Lynch.
I haven't bought "Only Human" yet. Illyria's a character whose voice really gets me. There are moments where I feel she's realized on the page, but often times her speech is made too modern. Illyria is inner Shakespeare pushed through a subtle, modernizing lens. She adopts personas and can speak in different ways, but I think her true voice is uncompromising in its anachronistic speech patterns. Sadly, considering how perfectly Illyria's character design transfers to the comics medium, her voice and characterization are often touch. I think Lynch had some great moments with Illyria, but it's a really high bar to reach Joss/Acker/Illyria. I'm a bit leery of "Only Human" because of this.
ETA: Wyn, I feel that HCs for comics should be made with the intention of including special extras and those extras should be for when the story is finished. It's like getting a Collector's Edition of BtVS before Season 7 had even been filmed. Um, wha? It makes me wonder if there's going to be a Super Mondo Hardest Cover Ever Special Deluxe Edition of After the Fall now that it is finished.
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Post by Wyndam on Sept 14, 2009 17:32:55 GMT -5
In the end, as long as I get a HC for a series I enjoy, I am happy. Angel got them sooner rather than later, and Buffy later rather than sooner. I can wait, I just want damn HC's. ;D
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Post by Emmie on Sept 14, 2009 18:04:04 GMT -5
I want my damn HCs!
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Paul
Ensouled Vampire
[Mo0:34]
Posts: 1,173
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Post by Paul on Sept 14, 2009 20:42:10 GMT -5
Everyone gushes about IDW's hardcovers, but they don't seem to be very consistant condition-wise. My AtF Vol. 3 and Spike: AtF both have wonky spines (all the ones in the shop were the same), which looks strange when they're sitting on the shelf. Weird, mine don't. I've read most of my copies 10+ times, and they look like they did when I just bought 'em. Oh, mine are the same as when I bought them, it's just the way they've been printed. It's superficial anyway, most people probably aren't as anal as me. See the Grand Canyon-sized gap between vols 3 and 4. IDW's old Angel TPBs had spine issues. My "The Curse" and "Spike" covers cracked off, because the glue was shitty. The hardcovers have had no problems (though some B&Ns locations seem to have beaten the shit out of them), and the TPBs (Lynch's SPIKE and BLOOD AND TRENCHES) have been fine. My old IDW Angel TPBs are fine, not that I ever look at them. I remember the old Dark Horse Buffy TPBs were shitty quality, they used to fall apart when you read them. I'm fairly sure that's just Thorn's store. None of the copies I've seen have that problem. No, mine had them too. I don't care that much. Lookie (excuse my camera's shit definition). That's the way it is with all comics. Warren from Season Eight has been ludicrous with all the errors, and Fray learns and forgets what "brake" means from issue to issue. Some errors from BUFFY and ANGEL were fixed, some weren't. For me, IDW's hardcovers are gush-worthy and Dark Horse's BUFFY TPBs are good as well. Physically good, the extras are not so much. I can also say that Dark Horse makes a good hardcover, as I have "The Long Way Home" in HC. Not IDW status, because still no extras, but it's a damn nice volume. I wish they did the rest of the series that way. Warren is an in-story continuity error, so it's the writer's fault, not DH's. These problems at IDW are basic spelling and printing errors that should have been caught by editors. I'm nit picking though, because the IDW hardcovers are sexy. I usually prefer paperbacks, and loathe premiere hardcovers... I hate having to wait 2 extra months or whatever it is for the latest X-Force. Normally, I would've waited for the Angel paperbacks but I was seduced by the sexiness of hardcovers. I just wish they'd all been as good quality as Vol. 1. Paul, I've gotta say it does irk me a little bit to see the HC Aftermath being reviewed to on the cover as "Volume 5". They're clearly working hard to link it to After the Fall. So much so that TFAW accidentally calls Aftermath "After the Fall Vol 5" on the sales page. Yeah, if Aftermath thinks it's getting on my Buffyverse shelf next to After the Fall it's got another thing coming. You're going under the bed to collect dust, mate. It's weird, but I almost feel like a "bad" fan for not supporting certain endeavors. Like the "Not Fade Away" and "Smile Time" comics - I don't see the point. I've even paged through them, but really if I want to relive those stories, I'll go watch the DVDs. I'm working through "Blood & Trenches" and finding it enjoyable, while a bit jarring for characterization reasons. "Aftermath" was a wash for me. I enjoyed the first part of "Drusilla", though honestly there was more substance in the art than the story and I'm hoping the second issue delivers. I kept wondering - when does the story start...? And the preview for the second part didn't really reassure (though Lynch remarked on those pages not being the best choice for a preview). I'm looking forward to the funny Angel issues ahead by Lynch. I haven't bought "Only Human" yet. Illyria's a character whose voice really gets me. There are moments where I feel she's realized on the page, but often times her speech is made too modern. Illyria is inner Shakespeare pushed through a subtle, modernizing lens. She adopts personas and can speak in different ways, but I think her true voice is uncompromising in its anachronistic speech patterns. Sadly, considering how perfectly Illyria's character design transfers to the comics medium, her voice and characterization are often touch. I think Lynch had some great moments with Illyria, but it's a really high bar to reach Joss/Acker/Illyria. I'm a bit leery of "Only Human" because of this. I felt like a bad fan for dropping Aftermath, but I knew I was going to get the HC (might as well have the collected edition) and didn't want to buy the series twice. The adaptations I don't bother with, I bought the Smile Time HC but that was only for Shadow Puppets. I rejoined the Angel series with Epilogue, and plan to keep getting it. Only Human is okay, I mainly like it for the artwork. I actually think Illyria translates badly to comics, because so much of her character was her quirky, twitchy movements and insane expressions. Her dialogue is still good, but you don't get the same alien feel from her.
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neowhobaz
Respected Watcher
"Beyond the Shadow you settle for, there's miracle illuminated"[Mo0:0]
Posts: 594
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Post by neowhobaz on Sept 15, 2009 11:09:55 GMT -5
Its good to see that people are having a change of heart for this. Not in the sense that they're gushing for aftermath or anything but at least being able to accept it as a mediocre ( I dont say bad because I liked the last and first issue just not the ones in between) epiosde/ mini series rather than pretend it didn't happen.
For those that don't like it, just think of the episode of family guy when stewie marries olivia but realizes he hates it. I'll be bryan and you guys be stewie:
Brian: Stewie...it's ok Stewie: Don't do this man, don't do this to me man.
lol
but seriously with sucky comics we can just hope and get excited that what comes next is better.
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Post by Emmie on Sept 16, 2009 20:09:44 GMT -5
To be clear, I'm still pretending it didn't happen.
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neowhobaz
Respected Watcher
"Beyond the Shadow you settle for, there's miracle illuminated"[Mo0:0]
Posts: 594
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Post by neowhobaz on Sept 16, 2009 20:22:56 GMT -5
what about only human emmie?
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Post by Emmie on Sept 16, 2009 22:22:03 GMT -5
what about only human emmie? Doesn't count as Aftermath which is my focus in this thread. I haven't read Only Human yet. IDW's releases of the issues is driving me a bit off. I don't have time to go to my comic store every Wednesday. I'll eventually read the series, though.
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Darth Rosie
Ensouled Vampire
I do doodle
Keeper of Didacity [? Astray][Mo0:12]
Posts: 1,392
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Post by Darth Rosie on Oct 2, 2009 4:08:22 GMT -5
My HC copy also has ink stains, and a page which is ripped in two. I am thinking of sending it back to Amazon, but I don't konw if I want to bother. I find the art horrible. I especially dislike how Kate and Gwen are drawn. Maybe I am shallow, but I found the storyline and stories quite entertaining. Easygoing stuff, nothing epic. Dez is a fun character, I alos like the two "guardians of divine balance between the celestial and demon worlds". The strongly remind me of the gatekeepers to the powers that be in season 1. I agree with those who say Aftermath has this season 1 feel.
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Randi Giles
Wise-cracking Sidekick
I Want to Believe
Moon Eyes in disguise.[Mo0:34]
Posts: 2,616
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Post by Randi Giles on Oct 5, 2009 20:06:47 GMT -5
Okay I finished reading Athermath a few hours ago and it was okay. I have to be honest and say it is not as good as ATF or P&P which I also had just got today. I haven't even finshed reading P&P and it's aleady better. Now that I think of it I think I'm just pissed at the artwork. Not that it wasn't good, but I just like how in ATF you recognized Angel, Cordy, Wes, Spike, Kate and everybody. I swear I didn't ercognize who the hell Kate and Gwen was when they first showed them. And Angel looked like he was on steriods and...I'm going to stop now.
EDIT: It also annoyed me that the bookmark strip made a ink mark on two of the pages. Just had to add that.
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Darth Rosie
Ensouled Vampire
I do doodle
Keeper of Didacity [? Astray][Mo0:12]
Posts: 1,392
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Post by Darth Rosie on Oct 7, 2009 0:05:26 GMT -5
You were lucky if you had ink marks on only two of the pages. Mine spread across at least 10 of them. But since I don't like the artwork anyway that seems quite fitting.
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Randi Giles
Wise-cracking Sidekick
I Want to Believe
Moon Eyes in disguise.[Mo0:34]
Posts: 2,616
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Post by Randi Giles on Oct 7, 2009 10:03:33 GMT -5
Ten pages, thas really sad.
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Post by Darth_Yotho on Jan 31, 2010 16:37:50 GMT -5
Received my HC yesterday after some audition work. So it was great to kick back and read the continuation of after the fall. But what I didn't get.
I saw preview's of issue #28 where the Hyperion Hotel is back. But in aftermath they introduce this "Church". Will that be explained? OR is that one of the reasons people are pretending "Aftermath" didn't happen.
I enjoyed aftermath with the character of "Dez". I didn't like some dialogues and the character Gwen was annoying and didn;t make any sense. She wasn't Gwen from the series nor from After the Fall. Also Kate's drawing was WAY off. Glad to see it's better in newer issue's.
The introduction of Angels was also a but much, I mean giving them the cupid wings and gladiator armour? Really! Oh well ...
* All I had with my HC was that the page-ribbon left large staines on the pages it was placed between when I got it. But it weren't significant pages so I was like .. w/e no need to return it to Amazon etc.
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batboy99
Potential Slayer
You're a little impressed, admit it.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 199
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Post by batboy99 on Dec 7, 2010 18:40:22 GMT -5
Man, its kinda sad that people really hate the art since Ross is one of my teachers haha. I have flipped through it and yeah, I dont like his Kate, really looks nothing like Rohm at all. But his Angel is alright. Definitely not his best work. He is actually a fairly good artist(though I am not fond of this women that much. Frankly, I like the way I draw women ALOT more).
I got to ask though, I hear alot of people complain about the story. What makes it so bad? Ive read up to vol 5 so far and I have loved it all so far.
Also why dont people like Runge's art?
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Post by Skytteflickan88 on Dec 7, 2010 19:14:17 GMT -5
In case After the fall had sucked, I think people would like the art and writing a lot more, because it is decent, but since it's compared to After the fall, it looks bad (I realize this isn't true for all, but I bet it's true for some).
I would probably like the arc much more as well in cased I hadn't liked After the fall (although I never really loved that arc, but I like it more than Aftermath). It is very season 1-ish, which I dig. I miss the Angel Investigation days, and this arc was a nice reminder of that.
Btw, I find myself not loving issue 23-25, which puts Aftermath in a better light than it would have in case I had loved them.
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batboy99
Potential Slayer
You're a little impressed, admit it.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 199
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Post by batboy99 on Dec 7, 2010 19:16:50 GMT -5
I totally get it. I odnt find this art bad myself, it is good, but I dont think his style fits this series. He's much more of a typical marvel/dc artist. Superheroes is huge fight scenes. Angel is alot more, how do i put this..... ''realistic'? I guess? And yeah, the likenesses are a bit off. I mean, I can tell its Angel, but I would like him to look a little more like DB. But then again, thats just Ross' style. I do like Urru's art alot better though, especially for this series.
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