Women not being allowed to kill.

[AngelFaith]

May 4, 2010 15:10:39 GMT -5 N.D.U.O said:

I was thinking not only on the women not being allowed to kill, but also on the thin line between chivalry and sexism, like in Awakening, Angel saying he doesn't want Cordy or Fred downstairs when he loses his soul? Why? Because they will immediatly break into tears?

No, I think it's because he knows Angelus will immediately focus on the girls - it's his way. And that seeing the girls will somehow give him more incentive to try and break free.

I mean, his "I'll rape you to death" comment to Fred is horrendous and later on his tells Cordy "I think I'll start with the twins'. I just think he wanted to spare them the sexual threats which he obviously wouldn't make to the males.

[BlueJay]

Supersymmetry would have been a perfect episode for Anyanka to guest-star in.

[harrycanyon]

Women should kill, it's their right to kill is it not?

[Eric]

May 22, 2010 23:32:05 GMT -5 harrycanyon said:

Women should kill, it's their right to kill is it not?

Last time I checked neither men nor women had the right to kill.

[Billie Erin]

It is a little sexist, but with Angel we must remember that the main character's from 250 eyars ago when things weren't so equal and he hasn't exactly been around and sane for the 70s

[dusk3333]

May 4, 2010 20:37:33 GMT -5 AngelFaith said:

May 4, 2010 15:10:39 GMT -5 N.D.U.O said:

I was thinking not only on the women not being allowed to kill, but also on the thin line between chivalry and sexism, like in Awakening, Angel saying he doesn't want Cordy or Fred downstairs when he loses his soul? Why? Because they will immediatly break into tears?

No, I think it's because he knows Angelus will immediately focus on the girls - it's his way. And that seeing the girls will somehow give him more incentive to try and break free.

I mean, his "I'll rape you to death" comment to Fred is horrendous and later on his tells Cordy "I think I'll start with the twins'. I just think he wanted to spare them the sexual threats which he obviously wouldn't make to the males.

I think a lot of it had to do with the fact that he didn't want them to see him like that. Not that they would be upset, but he didn't want them to see the monster inside him - even though Cordy had lived through it once already.


As far as Fred killing or not killing - think about what it would have done to her character. Look at Faith, for example. Some could argue she was already on the path to the darkside when she killed the Deputy Mayor, but her character downward spiralled much faster after that incident. That was the definate turning point for Faith from good to bad. Until then, she was straddling the fence. Did we look at her the same after she did that? Or was Faith different in our eyes after that happened?

The same question can be asked of Fred. Had she killed the professor, would she have been the same Fred in our eyes? Would she have stayed the same person we had come to love or would she become a darker character? Would we have looked at her the same? I think it was mostly that they wanted to keep Fred the sweet caring character for as long as possible. If she had killed the professor, she would have been no better than him - justified or not.

[tkts]

There's a similar moment in BtVS when Giles suffocates Ben so Buffy won't have to.

In a way, it's more a matter of knowing that she won't kill him, because she's too much of a hero to commit murder, while Giles is more accustomed to dealing with moral gray areas. But there does seem to be a certain amount of paternalism in the decision. (Which is not necessarily sexist or inappropriate, since Giles by that point has essentially become Buffy's only parental figure. I think it has more to do with age and experience than with gender.)

I agree with the person above who noted that Angel, having been born in the 18th century, probably does have somewhat outdated sexual politics.