El Diablo Robotico
Ensouled Vampire
Robo Pimp-Daddy
"Surely you have heard about our great victory over the Devil's Robot."[Mo0:3]
Posts: 1,199
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Post by El Diablo Robotico on Apr 8, 2008 17:38:48 GMT -5
For the rest of it, if the point is that the comics aren't as good as the shows: well, DUH! Thanks, Captain Obvious. But they're a whole hell of a lot better than nothing at all. I think I hear this kind of logic all too much. It being better than nothing isn't much of a compliment. Better than nothing isn't enough for some people; and you agree with what the article guy said so what's the use of making something out of it? hehe "Better than nothing" was maybe not the best choice of words on my part. What I meant is that I want more of both stories, and of course, ideally I'd love it if both shows were still on the air, but if it has to be done in another format, I'm on board with that. As long as it's done well, which both these series have been so far. If you go into the comics expecting something exactly like the shows, which this writer apparently did, you're gonna be disappointed. If you go into them with an open mind, you're probably gonna get a lot more out of them. My big complaint with the article, tho, was that it's much harder on AtF than S8, for the main reason that the demons look different. And as I tried to point out, there have been more than a few demons on both shows that were way outside the standard 'guy-in-a-rubber-mask' look. So there's plenty of precedent in the shows for the way the demons look in AtF.
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Post by wenxina on Apr 8, 2008 17:43:31 GMT -5
True I've been thinking about that after posting. Perhaps a better example would be the commando gear and all the spiffy new weapons they sometimes use now. I prefer the fights where Buffy's ingenuity and use of her environment counted more than what awesome ray gun she had. Erm... Buffy killed that demon in #1 with a giant crucifix. I call that (divinely) inspired. Sorry, couldn't help the crappy pun. The fancy weaponry has been kept to the minimum. The armory is full of medieval weapons, and even when infiltrating the base in #4, she used only her Scythe.
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Post by henzINNIT on Apr 8, 2008 18:03:00 GMT -5
My big complaint with the article, tho, was that it's much harder on AtF than S8, for the main reason that the demons look different. And as I tried to point out, there have been more than a few demons on both shows that were way outside the standard 'guy-in-a-rubber-mask' look. So there's plenty of precedent in the shows for the way the demons look in AtF. I agree. The style of the drawn demons aren't far from what we saw in the closing moments of "Not Fade Away" alone, which showed a large number of crazier looking shapes and sizes. It's unfair that the comic is panned for that.
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Post by wenxina on Apr 8, 2008 18:20:59 GMT -5
My big complaint with the article, tho, was that it's much harder on AtF than S8, for the main reason that the demons look different. And as I tried to point out, there have been more than a few demons on both shows that were way outside the standard 'guy-in-a-rubber-mask' look. So there's plenty of precedent in the shows for the way the demons look in AtF. I agree. The style of the drawn demons aren't far from what we saw in the closing moments of "Not Fade Away" alone, which showed a large number of crazier looking shapes and sizes. It's unfair that the comic is panned for that. And for some reason, some of the demons looked like Uruk Hai from the LoTR movie trilogy. I'm referring to the ones in the Connor story in First Night.
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Post by Emmie on Apr 8, 2008 18:33:46 GMT -5
lol you responded with the exact example that i'd thought of...i just didn't want to get into listing exceptions
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Post by wenxina on Apr 8, 2008 18:37:21 GMT -5
I didn't mean to go against what the others have said... I just wanted to point out that for some reason, they decided to copy the design from those movies.
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ded1
Rogue Demon Hunter
The Zombie Lord
BRAINS!!![Mo0:8]
Posts: 468
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Post by ded1 on Apr 8, 2008 19:19:14 GMT -5
Here's what I think:
The cannon issue,to me anyway,isn't an issue.Joss says it's cannon[for now] so it's cannon.
The medium issue is fair.Comics aren't as popular as television,so you aren't going to get the same volume of people being exposed to the story.I believe every medium has strengths and weaknesses[even TV]Adapting to the differences can be challenging to alot of people.While I do miss the actors and the subtle nuances that they bring to the characters,I've watched the show enough where I can easily use my observations to fill in the blanks there absence creates.
As far as the demon issue,How many times did you see a demon on either show and say 'that looks so fake'[Reptile Boy screams at me as I reread that statement].As for Angel,He faced alot of human-esque demons on the show on earth.In the comic,he is in a hell dimension.Why is it hard to believe that he may have to take on a "massively-proportioned demons"?
Posted by emmie on 04/08/08 at 17:51
I feel that this is actually what the season is about.On the show,Buffy was told that she alone stands between the life and death of the world.There were even times on the show where she didn't want Xander involved if she could help it.Now,she has an army of slayers.Why involve ordinary humans in the fight?Also,on the show,she was trying to integrate a normal life with her destiny.Now,with her role as general,it seems she's giving in completely to the slayer mission and giving up her dreams of normalcy[even if she doesn't always like it].Remember,things are off-balanced due to the activation spell.
there's my $0.02
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El Diablo Robotico
Ensouled Vampire
Robo Pimp-Daddy
"Surely you have heard about our great victory over the Devil's Robot."[Mo0:3]
Posts: 1,199
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Post by El Diablo Robotico on Apr 8, 2008 19:30:58 GMT -5
I love Buffy season 8 and Angel After The Fall BUT my only two problems are that: 1) Joss has said a few times that if Buffy season 8 and Angel: After The Fall had been on tv or a movie they would have been completley different. No castle, no giant Dawn, no battle armor. Um...ahem. I think you're exaggerating. All he said was he may or may not stick with the canon of the comics if given the chance to make a film. He didn't give any specifics, unless I missed some huge interview. No, there was an interview awhile back where he said that Giant Dawn was something they never could have done on the show. But unlike "Angel", where a lot of his plans for S6 have been worked into AtF, he had no post-S7 plans for "Buffy", and when he decided to do S8 as a comic, his plans evolved around what was and wasn't possible in the comic format. I don't see where there's any problem with that--should he somehow limit himself in his writing to what would've been possible on TV, even tho he's not writing it as a TV show any longer? How does that make sense?
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El Diablo Robotico
Ensouled Vampire
Robo Pimp-Daddy
"Surely you have heard about our great victory over the Devil's Robot."[Mo0:3]
Posts: 1,199
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Post by El Diablo Robotico on Apr 8, 2008 20:25:27 GMT -5
We're talking about post Season 8, not before it. Joss never said that post 8 he would get rid of the castle, giant Dawn, battle armor, etc. We are? Gosh, silly me, I thought we were talking about how S8 and AtF differ in comic-form compared to how they would've been done in TV or movie format.
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Post by dgryphon on Apr 8, 2008 20:34:09 GMT -5
No, I believe those two series are canon, too. Certainly all the new characters introduced in them--Tenel Ka, Zekk, Lowbacca, Tahiri--have become part of accepted canon, in the "New Jedi Order" and "Legacy of the Force" series that are set after them. The "Young Jedi Knights" series (the one about Jacen and Jaina), tho written for kids, are actually some of my favorite "Star Wars" books... Yeah they are considered canon, for the reasons you stated. I actually love that series as well, I read them all the time when I was younger. I think the only thing Lucas doesn't approve of now, from the YJK series was a Wookie being a Jedi (which is why Lowbacca is the only one in existence, and why his role has never been very large since the New Jedi Order). But yeah, EVERYTHING that is released with the Star Wars label has to be approved by Lucas first, which then makes them canon and apart of the Star Wars universe. Hate to go back to this, but I just wanted to clarify something really quickly. I should have included the titles of those children's series. YJK and JJK are most definitely canon... I own the entire YJK series and find it very important in understanding the new generation of Jedi Knights. The "noncanon" series to which I was referring are the Galaxy of Fear novels and the Jedi Prince series. They aren't considered part of SW continuity. Sorry for going back to this, but I didn't want to seem like an idiot to other Star Wars fans. And looking back at my post, it is really vague.
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Post by wenxina on Apr 8, 2008 20:41:14 GMT -5
You know what I really like about the Buffy Season 8 comics? No stand-in double for SMG every other shot of battle choreography. I get that risking bodily harm isn't a good idea when you're the star of the show, but for someone with a brown belt in Taekwondo, you'd think she'd do some of the fighting herself. But in the comics, no such continuity problems as slightly different hair placement, Buffy's thighs getting much larger when she's carrying Dawn and running from Glory, etc. Plus, no overlap of actor/persona: SMG's tattoos are clearly visible in some shots (I noticed them in "Grave" but there may have been other instances), while the only tattoo I know Buffy ever got (on airtime) was from Ethan, and she apparently had that removed. Or maybe she didn't. Meh.
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balesthebloody
Wise-cracking Techno Genius
"Angel's gettin' some! Good on you mate!"[Mo0:0]
Posts: 733
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Post by balesthebloody on Apr 8, 2008 20:58:28 GMT -5
I just don't see what the big deal is. I think that the person that wrote that can't be a die hard Buffy and Angel fan. To me seeing these characters back in action is what makes it for me. Plus the writing has been great! I mean as with everything you have to suspend disbelief. I'm sorry that some people are just upset because the medium has changed, but that is no reason to leave the fan base. if you did or do then you have to call yourself a fan of THE SHOW not the Buffyverse. I also saw the article as a way to bash Angel:After the Fall. Which I think is better a tad bit better than Season 8 but I still love them both!!
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Post by Giant Michael on Apr 9, 2008 6:29:21 GMT -5
Sometimes it has to be a general consensus of fans. Fanon! It's a real thing. Well it depends, did you watch Buffy for the writing or the acting. If it was more for the writing, then Season 8 is obviously going to be more official for you. Since this is Joss and his team writing it. It's Buffy scripts with comic book pictures. But... it's not. It's a completely different medium, that tells stories in a completely different way. And, to be honest with you, what we've seen haven't been very good stories. They're not all that true to the show, character development has been sacrificed in favour of hilarious/epic sweeping gestures, and in a lot of instances some of the writing doesn't really translate. And the Buffyverse take on Scotland? Jesus. Christ. The cannon issue,to me anyway,isn't an issue.Joss says it's cannon[for now] so it's cannon. Which is, if people would only read the damn article without flying off the handle because someone 'panned' the comics, the point; they're canon, for now, but if Joss has admitted to overwriting the whole thing if he did another series or a film... where does that leave them? For my money, I think it was something Joss said without really thinking about how it would make the fans - who have invested in the comics - feel; I think he'd work around them, although I'm very doubtful that we'll ever see the Buffy cast back together. The First got to it somehow? Yeah. I hear he bought himself a stylin' pimp hat. MB x
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Post by capricek on Apr 9, 2008 8:16:12 GMT -5
My biggest complaint is that we have to wait so long for each issue, especially since we get an episode length story split over 4 issues. You wait a whole month for 30 pages you can read in 10 minutes, I always feel disappointed that it's over almost as quickly as I start. I think either having them bi-weekly or twice as long would help the stories feel more like an episode.
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Post by wenxina on Apr 9, 2008 8:56:17 GMT -5
Actually, if I recall correctly, those of us who weren't petitioning for a biweekly release had actual reservations, not because we didn't want to read more often. One, financial/economic woes. Two, the sacrifice of quality of writing/art. Three, this was my concern, so it doesn't apply to anyone else unless they feel the same way, having multiple artists work on a single run tends to rob a series of its distinctive look.
EDIT: I'd refer to the appropriate thread if this discussion was to be continued though... it's been untouched for a while now.
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Post by wenxina on Apr 9, 2008 9:00:08 GMT -5
The First got to it somehow? Yeah. I hear he bought himself a stylin' pimp hat. MB x Since we're doing urban legends of Watcher's Council wealth... I heard the old fuddy daddies are really old school about money and decided to keep their wealth in their own safe. Guess it all went kaplooey.
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Post by capricek on Apr 9, 2008 9:52:09 GMT -5
EDIT: I'd refer to the appropriate thread if this discussion was to be continued though... it's been untouched for a while now. Sorry I only joined yesterday so was unaware of the other thread.
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