Out of the Willow Fanclub?*Spoilers*

[eriktheslayerboy]

Anyone else feeling like they are out of the Willow Fanclub especially with this last issue that came out. I mean everyone seems to be coming down on poor Buffy when she hasn't really done anything. Yet Willow seems to be having a affair with snakelady with magic an everything. No one really seems to mind that I mean no matter how annoying Kennedy is to some of you that is bad in a whole new level. Then in the feature she wants to kill Buffy? I mean we don't really know why yet but whatever it is she blames Buffy for it. Everyone just sort of assumes she had reason for turning dark when she hasn't been all that great in general lately in the none feature. She is just been really weird lately especially with the whole magic thing. The whole I can fly everywhere is annoying. I am just placing some guilt where I think it should be.

[witcher]

Well I'll admit that Willows behavior is a little strange, and if this happened before season 7 I would be the first one to say that she is way in over her head and that someone is gonna get hurt. But from the beginning of season 7 Willow looked more wiser and careful with her magic.
You are, just a little bit, jumping to conclusions. We have no idea who Saga really is or what are her motives.
Also if FDW was just crazy and evil again ( well more crazy anyway) she would not seem so sad and tormented with guilt.
Buffy did something wrong.. thats the message of TOYR. Is it true we don't know. But I;m not ready to turn my back on my favorite character until I get some hard proof that she is just evil.
And btw yes Kennedy sucks. Her relationship with Willow always looked like "Hey we are the only lesbians in the gang! The world is gonna end! Lets sleep together in spite the fact that we have 0 chemistry going on!"

[spectre]

Sept 5, 2008 13:56:05 GMT -5 witcher said:

But from the beginning of season 7 Willow looked more wiser and careful with her magic.

Great point. Willow is finally breaking away from the insecurities that haunted her through the first seven seasons. In fact, she seems more confident than ever (dreadfully sad, yet confident), and I truly expect to see a twist in #19 that supports this. Just as Buffy has had to make hard choices between her friends and her "duty," Willow is now faced with those same choices. Something is wrong with the slayer line; perhaps this started when Willow raised Buffy from the dead in Season 6 and continued when she activated all the potentials. I am not sure. However, mark my words. Despite appearances, Willow will end up having very good reasons for her actions. As one last point, Fray believes FDW, and Fray is no pushover.

[vampiresaiyan]

Def. Agreeing with Mikey. Willow to me is still the best! She has changed, but we also don't know what she has gone through so yeah.

VS ^vv^

[soulbrave]

Now Im 100% with mikey
xD

I Think that i can Understand Willow from the future (even that i don´t know why she´s doing those things)
The Only thing that i can tell is that Buffy did something wrong, and yes, maybe she didn´t want to, but ok, the thing that we saw in TOYL3 (don´t save the people from the vampires) wasn´t cool from buffy, she is not the same, and maybe only in this way she could learn a lesson...

And Willow is not having an affair with Vasuki, she´s having sex with Kennedy for summoning Vasuki, so...

I will be with Willow, don´t matter what...

[Skytteflickan88]

I feel sorry for Willow. She is deep in a cheating mess that can't end well, but she needs to fess up.

Future Willow is for me a mystery, but I figure that anyone can change after a few centuries, so I just accept that she's potentially evil and move on. It's the present-Willow that I'm pissed of at. We seriosuly need a stand alone with her POV and narrative voice. I have never felt this alienated from any of the scoobies. Buffy from season 6&7 were twice as easy to understand than the season 8 Willow. I'm sure she has her reasons for being secrative, and even for keeping the truth from Kennedy, but she needs to get her act straight. Even if she's full of shame and guilt, she needs to be strong.

Kennedy deserves that. She might have an attitude but come on, that she was rude in season 7 does not mean that she's a full grown she-dog.

[Lukee]

Ew Willow banged Snake lady! Cheating on K. Bad Willow. Also the whole evil Future thing [well we don't know if she is evil or not yet]
Personally i don't like what Willow has been doing of late. I don't agree with this distance she's put up against Buffy as well Buffy has with her but i think it more Willow doing the wall building here. I don't like she doesn't trust Buffy around Ken Doll [side bar ewww] its not Buffy's fault Tara died, hello she was happy to be left dead.

I cant see why people are blaming Buffy for this future if they are. Form what we have seen she hasn't really done anything wrong. Sure she robbed a bank but that was for the great good shall i say. They need the money. She got them the money.

Sure Willows sex with Greenish women could have been to help Buffy but [if I'm right:P] what about the other time with snake lady.
So id say Willow is in the wrong more then Buffy and I'm a big Willow fan.

[spectre]

Sept 8, 2008 7:09:07 GMT -5 Skytteflickan88 said:

I feel sorry for Willow. She is deep in a cheating mess that can't end well, but she needs to fess up..

You are stating the thoughts of many readers, so perhaps I am alone in my views that Willow is not cheating. Is she using Kennedy to make contact with Vasuki and is she keeping the details from Kennedy? Absolutely! But hey, Willow has a habit of omitting certain details when she is not proud of her actions. She has been rather sweet and innocent when doing this in the past, but now, she's just seems sad about it.

Also, I think Vasuki is getting a sexual kick (kind of like a voyeur) out of the way Willow makes contact with her, but I do not see this as Willow actively cheating.

[Tyler Austin "tiewashere"]

I still love Willow and think she is super interesting

[alycat7]

There is nothing that Willow can do that could make me doubt her in any way. I love her too much.

[birdandbear]

Sept 8, 2008 20:28:40 GMT -5 spectre said:

Sept 8, 2008 7:09:07 GMT -5 Skytteflickan88 said:

I feel sorry for Willow. She is deep in a cheating mess that can't end well, but she needs to fess up..

You are stating the thoughts of many readers, so perhaps I am alone in my views that Willow is not cheating. Is she using Kennedy to make contact with Vasuki and is she keeping the details from Kennedy? Absolutely! But hey, Willow has a habit of omitting certain details when she is not proud of her actions. She has been rather sweet and innocent when doing this in the past, but now, she's just seems sad about it.

Also, I think Vasuki is getting a sexual kick (kind of like a voyeur) out of the way Willow makes contact with her, but I do not see this as Willow actively cheating.

I'm also in the "it's not (quite) cheating" camp. Willow is using sexual energy to summon Vasuki while she is physically with Kennedy. I don't think what takes place on some astral plane can actually be classified as cheating if the two of them have never been together in the flesh, but it is certainly duplicitous and sneaky, and smacks of a total lack of regard for her lover - all of which feels exactly like cheating. So even though I've never been a Kennedy fan, I feel for her on this: finding out that your girlfriend has been fantasizing about someone else during your most passionate moments has got to suck big time.

And yeah, Vasuki gets off on it. Possibly because she's stealing Kennedy's rightful intimacy. Some people love to take someone else's lover. It's a power trip.


As for FDW, She seems more sad to me than evil. I think that Buffy is fated to do something that (in Willow's eyes) is so atrocious that the only way to put it right is to kill Buffy before she can do it. As for what heinous sin that might be, I have no idea.
Maybe the veiny look comes from the strain of clinging to the last ghostly vestiges of magic for a couple of centuries while she awaited her chance...

[Skytteflickan88]

I'm still waiting for Joss to reveal "Oh, no, Willow didn't cheat, Kennedy was dead, Willow DID NOT SPEND THAT SIX MONTH WALKABOUT AS SAGA'S LOVE-TOY". They haven't had sex at all and that revealing and intimate picture in Anywhere But Here, Willow pushed away Saga right after that.

That's how I want it to be. That Joss is torturing us.

I just came to think of this. What if Willow spent six month's with Saga? Maybe as her student, maybe lover...

Either way, Willow seems to feel guilty about taking contact with Saga, so there's something she doesn't want Saga to know. I'm afraid it will take 20 more issues before we find out.

I might kill myself.

(I wonder if Buffy thought that Willow cheated with Saga. In taht case I'm mad att Buffy too. She should so tell Kennedy. I was mad att Buffy in season 3 also, for not being openly disapointed at Willow & Xander.)

[xmadxscientistx]

I really loved season 8, all the way up to the Fray arch. I feel kinda lost, because I really don't get what's going on with any of these characters except Xander and Dracula. And Dawn, but that's assuming she'll eventually be back to (relatively) normal.

[eriktheslayerboy]

I am with skytteflickan88 on this one.

[dragonweaver]

I think it will take a heck of a lot more than what I've read in Season 8 to make me turn in my Willow Fan card.

For starters we don't know very much about Saga or Willow's connection to her. So far we've just been given bits and pieces of information and most everything else is speculation. I can see how people would think what Willow is cheating, perhaps she is, but it's obviously not as simple as that and there are so many variables missing right now. When did they meet? Did Willow go looking for Saga or was it the other way around? Is Willow's ability to fly a result of her training with Saga? What exactly was Willow's training? And more importantly what was Willow's motivation? Maybe she wanted more power or perhaps Kennedy's "death" was the main reason. Until I know the answers to these questions and get more information, I will hold off on judging her.

Also the same can be applied to FDW. I can't condemn Dark Willlow for her actions anymore than I could condemn Buffy for what she may or may not do in the furture. We just don't know what Buffy does to drive Willow over the edge. Heck we don't even know what Willow's plan is exactly.

Call me optimistic but I think in due time we will learn what's going on and that it will all make sense. I trust Joss to make this arc work and provide some kind of pay off that will either wrap things up or at least set up what's to come later on.

So to sum up: I don't agree. Willow rocks!!

[birdandbear]

Sept 11, 2008 6:11:48 GMT -5 dragonweaver said:

I think it will take a heck of a lot more than what I've read in Season 8 to make me turn in my Willow Fan card.

For starters we don't know very much about Saga or Willow's connection to her. So far we've just been given bits and pieces of information and most everything else is speculation. I can see how people would think what Willow is cheating, perhaps she is, but it's obviously not as simple as that and there are so many variables missing right now. When did they meet? Did Willow go looking for Saga or was it the other way around? Is Willow's ability to fly a result of her training with Saga? What exactly was Willow's training? And more importantly what was Willow's motivation? Maybe she wanted more power or perhaps Kennedy's "death" was the main reason. Until I know the answers to these questions and get more information, I will hold off on judging her.

Also the same can be applied to FDW. I can't condemn Dark Willlow for her actions anymore than I could condemn Buffy for what she may or may not do in the furture. We just don't know what Buffy does to drive Willow over the edge. Heck we don't even know what Willow's plan is exactly.

Call me optimistic but I think in due time we will learn what's going on and that it will all make sense. I trust Joss to make this arc work and provide some kind of pay off that will either wrap things up or at least set up what's to come later on.

So to sum up: I don't agree. Willow rocks!!

Agreed. Ain't nowhere near giving up on her yet.