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Post by loveisabird on Apr 20, 2009 2:31:04 GMT -5
:upset: We have all come across this a thread like this numerous times but as Im watching season 6 on my curremt Buffy watch through, I felt the need for this.
When I first watched season 6 and for the past 6 years I loved season 6. I found it interesting, partly relateable and a "fresh" season. Ive sadly come to find this time around that its infact my least favourite season, which is a big jump from favoruite to worst. Has this happened to anyone else before?
I dont know if its just because Im in a much happier place in life and I cant tolerate seeing the characters I love so much go through hell for almost an entire season. Its just so bleak. Wrecked and Dead Things where 2 of my favourite episodes but after watching them over the weekend I was like " WTF was I thinking?!", and theyre actually 2 of my worst episodes (along with Smashed). Wrecked had every drug cliche in the book and the episode idea was so poorly executed, especially since magic was a metaphor for Willow/Tara's experimentation in season 4. And then Dead Things felt so heartbreaking to watch because of Buffy's state of mind and Spike constantly telling Buffy she belonged in the dark. Spike saying that just made me fell gross and had me remembereing when Angel told Buffy she deserved someone who could take her into the light. And she does deserve that.
Ive totally started babbling but Id just like to know others opinions on season 6. I do appreciate that we all take dark turns in our lives (Ive took a few of my own in the past) and they do help shape us but with Buffy being sort of an escape and show to get lost in, Ive began to find it hard to watch. Im onto Hells Bells next and Im dreading it because I know it goes downhill for Xander : /
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gumgnome
Junior Vampire Slayer
Who has got the button?
Get out of my BRAIN![Mo0:1]
Posts: 970
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Post by gumgnome on Apr 20, 2009 2:40:08 GMT -5
I do still love Season 6 and actually find it less of a grim viewing than Season 5, which just goes downhill all the way to the end emotionally. I agree that Wrecked is a pretty weak episode, but i always thought so (and agree with everything you've said about the metaphor/cliche aspects). However, i do stand by Spike's lines in Dead Things. Angel can say that she deserves the light because he's a good guy with a soul. At the end of Season 6, no matter how much it might pain Buffy to admit it, Spike is still a soulless monster, an immoral man (look at his actions in As You Were, when she realises this). Spike says those things because he needs to justify his need for her.
It is by no means my favourite season, but i like it more than 1, 5 or 7 and a large part of that is because it does arch very nicely (Buffy's recovery from her trauma is really great to watch imo) and it throws unexpected turns (Xander saving the day). On top of that, you have a bunch of wonderful eps (OMWF, Normal Again, the last three are all great particularly Villains and Two to Go, Life Serial, Doublemeat Palace).
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Post by MrKittyFantastico on Apr 20, 2009 4:11:40 GMT -5
I'm quite the opposite. When I first watched Season 6 on television, I thought it was a bit meh overall, though some parts did stand out.
Now, after copious rewatches, I love Season 6 because it does feel like a different turn for the programme. It had always been about The Big Bad - to play down that for the aid of more evolution to the characters worked extremely well for a series that had spent the last 5 years priding itself on building and developing the characters. It made the programme feel fresh, which I imagine if the season hadn't been so dark and actually had a Big Bad (besides Life), it probably wouldn't have faired as well.
Season 6 does have my favourite episode, though - Normal Again. Something like that wouldn't have been possible in any other season, and it's just a perfect piece of television.
It may have been depressing, but Buffy has always been depressing. It's also always been funny. In my opinion, the heightened "dark" side of Season 6 also works in its favour because it makes the humourous moments (things like the Trio) just feel that much funnier when juxtaposed.
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Mathieu
Ensouled Vampire
[Mo0:0]
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Post by Mathieu on Apr 20, 2009 23:00:32 GMT -5
I loved the beginning of Season 6 with the resurrection, the Buffybot and how Buffy had to cope with being back and having all those responsabilities. Loved OMWF. Then it went downhill. Didn't like the middle of the season. And then it started to be great again about 6 or 7 episodes before the end. NORMAL AGAIN is one of my all time FAVORITE (hence the capital letters). And of course the final arc is a mind blower.
Overall, season 6 is really not that bad.
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ligeia
Potential Slayer
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Post by ligeia on Apr 21, 2009 11:21:01 GMT -5
When I first watched season 6, I liked it but I didn't really understand what the characters were going through, it was kinda fuzzy to me. Now that I've grown a little, I think I get much better what this season is all about and I like it even more. And I don't have to be depressed myself to enjoy a show with depressed characters... There are harsh moments but there are also some very funny episodes. And I like the magic/drug metaphor, even if it is cliché. Sometimes simple things are the best.
Overall, season 6 is one of the best for me.
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Mothling
Innocent Bystander
Don't warn the tadpoles![Mo0:37]
Posts: 21 
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Post by Mothling on Apr 22, 2009 11:15:52 GMT -5
I can completely identify and agree with me's opinion of Season 6, though I have never really found it to be one of my favorites in the first place.
I agree with mathieu, in that the Season opened interestingly, and picked up more towards the end (though I find it dropped again with the finalé). It's just the middle that is the fly in the ointment.
I just feel that the writers didn't handle the entire thing so well. Buffy was completely and utterly degraded, and the Willow "addiction" seemed like such an incredibly lazy tag-on. Never before Smashed or Wrecked did Willows relationship with magic seem like "junkie" behaviour, apart from her compulsive need to keep doing it. Willow also compulsively keeps notes on her classwork and marks them in coloured pens. Does this mean she is addicted too?? (That was sarcasm, by the way). Then suddenly in Smashed we have scenes of her rolling in at 10am, hallucinating, acting all weird and "high". It made magic seem like some kind of mind altering drug, which the show has never once portrayed it as. Infact, they used magic as a symbol for strength and intelligence, and as a metaphor of connection between Willow and Tara. And now it's akin to heroin? So Willow and Tara were "metaphorically" smoking crack in Tara's dorm?
It's just sad to me that they completely corrupted the metaphors magic stood for within the show, and don't even get me started on the completely hideous "magic" that was in the episode Smashed. Whisps of light pinging out of their fingers? Sabrina much?
As for the Buffy and Spike thing, I just found it deeply saddening. To see Buffy, a hero in my eyes, degraded in the arms of Spike was just horrible to watch. And Spike's telling Buffy that she was nothing and belonged in the dark with him was just saddening. Not that he was doing it, but that she was caving to it, and believing it. I know that's why I found it so distressing. How people can argue that Spike loved her when he was so willing to destroy her spirit just so she would be with him is something I will never understand.
I will probably post some more after I have had dinner. ^^
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gumgnome
Junior Vampire Slayer
Who has got the button?
Get out of my BRAIN![Mo0:1]
Posts: 970
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Post by gumgnome on Apr 23, 2009 3:50:40 GMT -5
As for the Buffy and Spike thing, I just found it deeply saddening. To see Buffy, a hero in my eyes, degraded in the arms of Spike was just horrible to watch. And Spike's telling Buffy that she was nothing and belonged in the dark with him was just saddening. Not that he was doing it, but that she was caving to it, and believing it. I know that's why I found it so distressing. How people can argue that Spike loved her when he was so willing to destroy her spirit just so she would be with him is something I will never understand. But isn't that what makes it great television? We've seen strong Buffy so many times, and now due to appalling circumstances (ripped out of heaven by her best friends) she falters badly. I've always thought that the only way that the writers can justify bringing her back from the dead again without cheapening death entirely is by having that action carry seriously bad consequences that last for a long time - here Buffy needs to suffer and lose herself before she's paid the price for coming back. What better way to show just how lost she is that she'll turn to someone she is revolted by for comfort? |
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Mothling
Innocent Bystander
Don't warn the tadpoles![Mo0:37]
Posts: 21
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Post by Mothling on Apr 23, 2009 9:54:07 GMT -5
But isn't that what makes it great television? We've seen strong Buffy so many times, and now due to appalling circumstances (ripped out of heaven by her best friends) she falters badly. I've always thought that the only way that the writers can justify bringing her back from the dead again without cheapening death entirely is by having that action carry seriously bad consequences that last for a long time - here Buffy needs to suffer and lose herself before she's paid the price for coming back. What better way to show just how lost she is that she'll turn to someone she is revolted by for comfort? Don't get me wrong, you're entitled to your opinion as to what makes it a good series over a bad one, and your points do make sense as to cheapening her death if they hadn't have done something darker, but that still doesn't change the fact that I still emotionally just find it too much. Drama is a good thing, I wouldn't find anything interesting about the series without it, but I just think it was just emotionally draining to me to watch it. And I am sure I'm not the only one, Sarah Michelle Gellar herself thinks the same. I find that in trying to create so much darkness and drama that they lost not only the character of Buffy, but much of what made the show the show. |
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Post by buffyverseforever on Apr 26, 2009 22:03:08 GMT -5
My only problem with Season 6 is Tara's death....
Best wishes,
Scott
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Mathieu
Ensouled Vampire
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,069
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Post by Mathieu on Apr 26, 2009 22:14:46 GMT -5
My only problem with Season 6 is Tara's death.... Best wishes, Scott If you take Tara's death back in Season 6, no Dark Willow. And the season would have become the worst season ever made on the show. It would have been a complete disaster, except for the amazing OMWF and Normal Again. I mean the storylines were ok but not outstanding, sometimes kind of confusing not to say all over the place. The Buffy/Spike realtionship was head scratching. Tara and Willow's relationship was on and off. Dawn the clepto (what the f...?) was whiny and annoying. Anya and Xander broke up. We had poor episodes. And more importantly the Trio had become the lamest Big Bad ever known to date and we couldn't see where the season was heading. And suddenly everything made sense in Seeing Red with the idea of a series of consequences that would lead our favorite Scoobies toward a heart breaking final arc. And we got Dark Willow, one of the most entertaining thing we ever got on the show. You still want to take Tara's death back? |
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Post by wenxina on Apr 26, 2009 22:56:47 GMT -5
Just a point I'd like to make. The Trio were never the Big Bads of S6. I remember them being referred to as the Little Bads, or something to that effect. Nor was Dark Willow the Big Bad of the season. The Big Bad was real-life, right from the start of S6. Life, in all its mundane glory, with the random bouts of shit happens, injustice, ugliness, needs, desperation, desires, death, grief, moving on, etc.
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Mathieu
Ensouled Vampire
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Post by Mathieu on Apr 26, 2009 23:05:47 GMT -5
Just a point I'd like to make. The Trio were never the Big Bads of S6. I remember them being referred to as the Little Bads, or something to that effect. Nor was Dark Willow the Big Bad of the season. The Big Bad was real-life, right from the start of S6. Life, in all its mundane glory, with the random bouts of shit happens, injustice, ugliness, needs, desperation, desires, death, grief, moving on, etc. That's my point dude, until Dark Willow came along I really thought the Trio was supposed to be the Big Bad of the season even though the whole thing seemed like a joke, so I was truly disappointed with the season 6 storyline at that point. Now I understand that they were some sort of comic relief and their foolish actions were meant to lead to Tara's death which was the real trigger of things going out of control. I know everybody keeps saying that real-life was the real Big Bad of the season (has Joss ever said that himself?) but, even though it's technically true, I like to think that Willow still was the Big Villain at the end, it's more bad-ass. |
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Paul
Ensouled Vampire
[Mo0:34]
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Post by Paul on Apr 26, 2009 23:12:30 GMT -5
I've always loved season six, but then I watched the series on DVD. I can see how it might have been a bit grueling on a week to week basis, what with the dark tone and apparent lack of direction, and why fans who watched it on TV might have bad feelings towards it. The only real problem I have is how the Willow storyline was mishandled in the middle of the season; she went from having a god complex to being a literal junkie, and it was all a bit inconsistant. Rather than ramble on, I'll just link to this review ( www.superjer.com/buffy/season_6_review.php ) which more or less articulates my feelings on what worked and didn't work about the season. |
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Iceeh★
Bad Ass Wicca
Also, Angels.
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Post by Iceeh★ on Apr 27, 2009 0:40:34 GMT -5
I liked season 6 a lot... minus Dead Things, Normal Again, and the last half of Seeing Red. And I don't get the Dark Willow love, I never really liked her. :/ (Even though she was pretty badass, heh)
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redhead
Common Vampire
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Post by redhead on Apr 27, 2009 4:09:24 GMT -5
I really liked season 6, probably my favorite later season. I like the "drama" of it all.
I liked Willow's "addiction" to magic. I never really saw it as an addiction in the sense of drugs though. Although I liked Tara and her death was very upsetting I was never angry at the writers for doing it. It was defiantly necessary to push Willow over the edge.
I also liked Buffy's storyline. I'm no Spuffy lover, but I quite liked watching Buffy self destruct... My only big problem with season 6 was Spike trying to rape Buffy. I just felt it was handled terribly, especially as it is such a real life problem. I felt they never really showed the consequences. Buffy is a strong woman, but something like that would effect even the strongest woman. Just with a show that has such a strong feminist message, it kind of failed BIG time there. I always thought they should of had Spike bite Buffy and try and turn her (but obviously not succeed).
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Post by henzINNIT on Apr 27, 2009 4:35:02 GMT -5
Season 6 is horrible. Truely horrible. I haven't been able to watch all the way through in years. The idea had potential, but the writers managed to waste it with a mass of mediocre episodes. OMWF is brilliant though.
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Post by Skytteflickan88 on Apr 27, 2009 5:13:33 GMT -5
It's a good season. Good writing, impressive arcs and poignant acting.
But I rarely watch it because I get so depressed seeing the character in such bad places in their lives, but I appreciate that the characters grew as people. We saw the good, the bad and the hideously ugly.
So I don't watch season 6 for the laughs. Even OMWF depresses me because every scene reminds me of what has happened so far in the season and what will come next.
So not a favorite season, but it's a good season. Or, you know, a necessary season.
Watching season 6 if kinda like having your tooth pulled out; It has to be done and it's great when it's over but the journey to non-toothness is not pleasant.
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Post by Wyndam on Apr 27, 2009 9:56:17 GMT -5
I don't have a problem with most of Season 6's arcs (Buffy/Spike, Dark Willow, The Trio, Tara, etc.), except for Xander and Anya splitting up and Giles leaving. I know there was nothing they could do about Anthony leaving the show, but that doesn't mean I will ever like it. Xander and Anya splitting up was just excessive and took the seasons main theme too far. Not necessary at all.
My main problem with it is that the episodes are just plain boring. Season 6 and some of Season 7 are the only seasons I can't watch at night any more, or else I will just pass out. While I don't think there are any bad seasons of Buffy, Season 6 is definitely the most boring.
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Post by hitnrun017 on Apr 27, 2009 14:14:08 GMT -5
My main problem with it is that the episodes are just plain boring. Season 6 and some of Season 7 are the only seasons I can't watch at night any more, or else I will just pass out. While I don't think there are any bad seasons of Buffy, Season 6 is definitely the most boring. That's my problem with both of these seasons too. I love them, but the later parts of both just can't compare to the previous seasons story and quality wise. In Season 2 we have Angel turn evil, in Season 3 Faith switches teams, in Season 4 Faith/Adam/Initiative revelations and in Season 5 Glory/Key drama and Joyce dies. Meanwhile in Season 6 Buffy gets a fast food job and in Season 7 she goes on a date. While there is some epic character development in Season 6, the mythology halted, no surprising twists and turns. |
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Marcos
Novice Witch
Define "human".[Mo0:30]
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Post by Marcos on Apr 27, 2009 16:10:52 GMT -5
CHARACTER'S DEVELOPMENT:
I think season 6 is the most daring thing I've ever seen in television, in terms of character development. It brings the darkness we are never ready to face, and I think that, judging from the perspective of psychological/philosophical development, it's the best season, 'cause it goes where no other has gone before. All the characters had powerful arcs (which never happened before, not like that).
PLOT ARCS:
Looking at the season's PLOT arcs, I can say it only works when Willow goes bad. That "real life as the big bad" thing is true. I think it would overload the season if it had a Glory-like villain if the characters were already so miserable. The Trio seemed like they were supposed to be the Big Bads, but they were there just for the sake of the fun. Life was Biggy and Baddy enough! No villain could make the Soobies hurt more than their personal live's inner demons.
So, I guess the season was perfectly planned in that sense, but I dunno, the Trio doesn't make me laugh as much as they should. I love some nerdy-comedy, but they were SO annoying most of the time.
It's also interesting, in this new arc structure, that slowly the comedy relief (the Trio) became more and more serious, to the point where they pull the trigger (pun intended) for a concrete Big Bad to show up. Even though Willow is all powers and kicks, she's nothing but a reflexe of the character's arcs. Life is still the Big Bad, because Life made DW (something like The First/Caleb). The character arc actually became the Big-Bad arc, and it rocked. Dark Willow is the biggest of the baddies.
EPISODIC QUALITY:
BUT, in terms of episode's pure narrative value, well, this season is weird. It had a bunch of really weak episodes, like Doublemeat Palace, Wrecked, Gone, As you Were, etc. The funny is, it also has as much above-average gems as any other season (Dead Things, OMWF, Normal Again, Grave, Villains, Entropy, Seeing Red). So, IMO, if you look at episodes alone, the quality goes rollercoasting top high to down below all the time. The average quality level of a Buffy episode (which is great, btw) is rarely found, IMO.
SO...
I don't like it, it's depressing, but I REALLY admire it. Every season has problems, and even though the Trio was really annoying as a comic relief (and terribly handled if you see them as Big Bads), they are still pretty watchable. And about the bad episodes, well, every season has some of those.
So, in a word, this season redefines what daring narrative means to me.
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