Post by joxerlives on Jan 3, 2010 12:25:13 GMT -5
LIES MY PARENTS TOLD ME
The Good;
All the flashback sequences are wonderful. Great to see the real Dru on the show again, love her expression when Spike talks of bringing his mum with them. Possibly the worst introduction of any new girlfriend to a prospective mother-in-law in the history of the world? The powerful scenes between Wood and Giles and the face off between Spike and Wood are awesome.
The Bad;
Spike just deciding to leave Nikki alone for a while after finding her beggars belief, couldn't they have had a police car pull up or something? Or was Spike worried about messing up his hair? No real comparison between Joyce and Nikki, Joyce died of natural causes, although heartbreaking for Buffy and Dawn there was no one to blame, it was just her time. Unsouled Spike hunted down and murdered Nikki for fun!
Best line;
Buffy (to Giles); "I think you've taught me everthing I need to know" Ooooohhhhhh!
Women good/men bad;
At the end of the ep Buffy shares a moment of intimacy with Dawn in bed then closes the door on Giles. The implication is that she chooses her literal and metaphorical sister(s) over her father figure?
Jeez!;
Spike's mum remarks that he wants to 'get inside her' again, yeeeesshhh! Her rejection of him is heartrending. The mindworm is also nasty, reminiscent of Star Trek 2. Spike's goading of Wood over his mother choosing slaying over him is nasty and very possibly not true as we learn in 'Damage'. Nikki sacrifices herself to save Robin and millions like him just as Buffy does in The Gift with Dawn, she loved him but she just couldn't be with him. Nikki just didn't bump into Spike on patrol, he hunted her down off-duty, she tells Robin he can't go home because she fears Spike will find them there. She never volunteered to be the Slayer and she couldn't quit. She dies trying to save him.
Wood's knuckledusters are pretty vicious but you'd think useful in a fight.
Kinky dinky;
Spike tells Nikki he's going to 'ride her hard'. She responds that he's 'wet and limp'. Xander bemoans the fact that Spike's chains weren't there last week when he and Anya had their breakup sex. Dru refers to Spike as 'sweet Willy' whilst he describes her as saucy.
Captain Subtext;
Needless to say a lot of people speculate on an incestuous attraction between Spike and his mum. I don't buy that, I think William is just a devoted son to his loving mother, even soulless Spike is horrified when she makes her incestuous suggestion. I'm quite prepared to accept Connor having sex with Cordy, that Ares is Xena's dad or even that Beatrice in Kill Bill might actually be his daughter but not this.
One reason Spike's mum might be so mean to him once sired is that she's jealous of Drusilla whom she refers to as 'That trollop'. Note Dru calls herself Spike's 'Other mummy'. Check out her little look as Spike stakes her, almost of relief/affection? Could she have been goading Spike into killing her?
Speaking of Oedipal implications as we suspected Wood tells Buffy that she reminds him of his mother. Interestingly whilst most girls would consider that a turn off, she seems to rather like the idea. According to the commentary Spike's mum is called 'Anne' which of course is Buffy's middle name. And upon seeing Spike's relationship with his own mother I think we all understand his apparently genuine affection for Joyce a lot better.
Andrew takes the call from Fred whom he thinks sounds 'effeminate'. Buffy substitutes 'prophylactic' for 'prokaryote' in regard to Spike which is a Freudian slip if ever there was one.
Guantanamo Bay;
Giles acts as a calculating general and wishes to kill Spike out of logic. Wood by contrast know's it's wrong but acts because his love for his mother is more powerful than all reason. Giles has actually started acting like Travers and the rest of the Watcher's Council but then so did Buffy in Potential, giving her girls their own Cruciantenam.
Scoobies to the ER;
Missing scenes;
12 minutes of extra footage according to the commentary? We must have entire movies of deleted scenes available for special edition DVD releases! One scene I think we'd all like to see is Giles confess to Buffy about killing Ben.
Apocalypses; 7,
Wheldon Cliches (with kind permission from Boo)
Scoobies in bondage: Spike in chains
Buffy: 9
Giles: 4
Cordy: 5
Will: 4
Jenny: 1
Angel: 4
Oz: 1
Faith: 3
Joyce: 1
Wes: 1
Xander; 3
Dawn; 4
Spike; 4
Scoobies knocked out: Poor Dawn although nothing is broken (at least Willow hopes so)
Buffy: 21
Giles: 12
Cordy: 6
Xander: 16
Will: 10
Jenny: 2
Angel: 6
Oz: 3
Faith: 1
Joyce: 3
Wes: 1
Anya;7
Dawn; 6
Tara; 1
Spike; 2
Kennedy; 1
Kills: 2 vamps for Spike (excluding his mum) and 2 for Buffy if we assume she finished off the vamp in the alley at the start
Buffy: 125 vamps, 62 demons, 6 monsters, 10 humans, 1 spirit warrior & a robot
Giles: 8 vamps, 2 demons, 2 humans/1 god.
Will: 6 vamps + 3 demons +1 fawn+1 human.
Oz: 3 vamps, 1 zombie, 1 werewolf,
Faith: 16 vamps, 5 demons, 3 humans
Xander: 6 vamps, 2 zombies, 1½ a demon, 2 humans
Anya: 1 vamp and 1½ a demon
Riley; 18 vamps + 7 demons
Spike; 11 vamps and 7 demons+1 human
Buffybot; 2 vamps
Tara; 1 demon
Dawn; 1 vamp + 1 demon
Kennedy; 1 human+1 vampire
Amanda; 1 vampire
Woods; 5 vamps and 2 demons
Scoobies go evil:
Giles: 1
Cordy: 1
Will: 4
Jenny: 1
Angel: 1
Oz: 1
Joyce: 1
Xander: 4
Anya; 1
Dawn; 1
Buffy; 1
Spike; 1
Wood; 1
Alternate scoobies:
Buffy: 8
Giles: 4
Cordy: 1
Will: 6
Jenny: 2
Angel: 3
Oz: 2
Joyce: 2
Xander: 4
Tara; 1
Dawn;1
Spike; 1
Anya; 2
Recurring characters killed: 15,
Jesse, Flutie, Jenny, Kendra, Larry, Snyder, Professor Walsh, Forrest, McNamara, Joyce, Katrina, Tara, Quentin Travers, Chloe, Jonathon.
Sunnydale deaths;
105
Total number of scoobies: 30 or so
Xander, Buffy, Dawn, Willow, Anya, Spike, Giles, Kennedy, Molly, Vi, Rhona, Amanda, Chao-Anh, Wood, Andrew plus an indeterminate number of potentials, at least a dozen or more.
Xander demon magnet: 6(7?)
Preying Mantis Lady, Inca Mummy Girl, Drusilla, VampWillow, Anya, Lissa (arguably Buffy & Faith with their demon essences?), Dracula?
Scoobies shot:
Giles: 2
Angel: 3
Oz: 4
Riley; 1
Buffy; 1
Tara; 1
Notches on Scooby bedpost:
Giles: 2; Joyce & Olivia, possibly Jenny and 3xDraccy babes?
Buffy: 4 confirmed; Angel, Parker, Riley, Spike. 3 possible, Dracula+RJ+Shadowmen's demon(?)
Joyce: 1;Giles, 2 possible, Ted and Dracula(?)
Oz: 3; Groupie, Willow & Verucca
Faith:2 ;Xander, Riley
Xander: 2; Faith, Anya
Willow: 2;Oz and Tara
Riley; 3; Buffy, Sandy and unnamed vampwhore
Spike; 2 Buffy and Anya
Anya; 2 Spike and Xander
Dawn in peril; 14
Dawn the bashful virgin; 9
What the fanficcers thought;
Questions and observations;
Buffy says she is now willing to sacrifice Dawn to save the world. Because she's older or because Buffy knows there's a heaven? Probably the latter as it's only after Giles remarks about what she's been through (death/afterlife) that she says it. She regards death as the reward for being human, the big dessert at the end of the meal. Or because Dawn is no longer her sole focus? She comments here that Dawn is 'tough'. Spike retains some of his humanity as a vampire (as the Judge senses in Becoming pt1), perhaps because of Dru's link to the PTB? When his mum is sick Spike suggests fetching Dr Gull which was also the name of Queen Victoria's physician and a popular suspect for Jack the Ripper but we've no proof it's the same guy. Willow recieves her phonecall from Fred in the Angel ep 'Orpheus'. Buffy still feels bad about how she treated her family and friends in 'Get it done', her punishment at the hands of the Shadowmen has actually benefitted her by bringing her to her senses in that regard, she's not so hardass any more. We really do have bad boy Spike back here, from now on he's the guy we know from seasons 2-4 but playing for the good guys. But deep down we know he'll always be William the Bloody (awful poet).
Nikki speaks of Robin liking playing with the 'Spooky doodas' at her Watcher's house. Does she mean the Shadow puppets we see in 'Get it Done'?
It speaks of Buffy's prowess as a Slayer that she can toy so effortlessly with the vamp whilst Giles talks to her. Does Spike mean what he says about not caring for Nikki or is this just revenge for his beating? Note both Spike and Angel(us) killed their mothers. Also although we don't see her use it Spike's mum has a wheelchair, no wonder he so hated being stuck in one for most of season 2.
So who's right? You've got to understand Wood's point, imagine if Spike had killed Joyce and went around wearing her coat as a trophy? Would anything on earth stop Buffy staking him? Or would he wake up on fire as Dawn promised? Again Wood is very similar to Holtz on Angel or Callisto on Xena. Note that Wood realises that souled Spike ISN'T the man who killed Nikki, he has to play 'Early one morning' to bring him out. Rare to have 2 eps with such a similar theme (Andrew and Spike's flashback filled redemption) in a row but it works fine.
Marks out of 10; 10/10 brilliant!
The Good;
All the flashback sequences are wonderful. Great to see the real Dru on the show again, love her expression when Spike talks of bringing his mum with them. Possibly the worst introduction of any new girlfriend to a prospective mother-in-law in the history of the world? The powerful scenes between Wood and Giles and the face off between Spike and Wood are awesome.
The Bad;
Spike just deciding to leave Nikki alone for a while after finding her beggars belief, couldn't they have had a police car pull up or something? Or was Spike worried about messing up his hair? No real comparison between Joyce and Nikki, Joyce died of natural causes, although heartbreaking for Buffy and Dawn there was no one to blame, it was just her time. Unsouled Spike hunted down and murdered Nikki for fun!
Best line;
Buffy (to Giles); "I think you've taught me everthing I need to know" Ooooohhhhhh!
Women good/men bad;
At the end of the ep Buffy shares a moment of intimacy with Dawn in bed then closes the door on Giles. The implication is that she chooses her literal and metaphorical sister(s) over her father figure?
Jeez!;
Spike's mum remarks that he wants to 'get inside her' again, yeeeesshhh! Her rejection of him is heartrending. The mindworm is also nasty, reminiscent of Star Trek 2. Spike's goading of Wood over his mother choosing slaying over him is nasty and very possibly not true as we learn in 'Damage'. Nikki sacrifices herself to save Robin and millions like him just as Buffy does in The Gift with Dawn, she loved him but she just couldn't be with him. Nikki just didn't bump into Spike on patrol, he hunted her down off-duty, she tells Robin he can't go home because she fears Spike will find them there. She never volunteered to be the Slayer and she couldn't quit. She dies trying to save him.
Wood's knuckledusters are pretty vicious but you'd think useful in a fight.
Kinky dinky;
Spike tells Nikki he's going to 'ride her hard'. She responds that he's 'wet and limp'. Xander bemoans the fact that Spike's chains weren't there last week when he and Anya had their breakup sex. Dru refers to Spike as 'sweet Willy' whilst he describes her as saucy.
Captain Subtext;
Needless to say a lot of people speculate on an incestuous attraction between Spike and his mum. I don't buy that, I think William is just a devoted son to his loving mother, even soulless Spike is horrified when she makes her incestuous suggestion. I'm quite prepared to accept Connor having sex with Cordy, that Ares is Xena's dad or even that Beatrice in Kill Bill might actually be his daughter but not this.
One reason Spike's mum might be so mean to him once sired is that she's jealous of Drusilla whom she refers to as 'That trollop'. Note Dru calls herself Spike's 'Other mummy'. Check out her little look as Spike stakes her, almost of relief/affection? Could she have been goading Spike into killing her?
Speaking of Oedipal implications as we suspected Wood tells Buffy that she reminds him of his mother. Interestingly whilst most girls would consider that a turn off, she seems to rather like the idea. According to the commentary Spike's mum is called 'Anne' which of course is Buffy's middle name. And upon seeing Spike's relationship with his own mother I think we all understand his apparently genuine affection for Joyce a lot better.
Andrew takes the call from Fred whom he thinks sounds 'effeminate'. Buffy substitutes 'prophylactic' for 'prokaryote' in regard to Spike which is a Freudian slip if ever there was one.
Guantanamo Bay;
Giles acts as a calculating general and wishes to kill Spike out of logic. Wood by contrast know's it's wrong but acts because his love for his mother is more powerful than all reason. Giles has actually started acting like Travers and the rest of the Watcher's Council but then so did Buffy in Potential, giving her girls their own Cruciantenam.
Scoobies to the ER;
Missing scenes;
12 minutes of extra footage according to the commentary? We must have entire movies of deleted scenes available for special edition DVD releases! One scene I think we'd all like to see is Giles confess to Buffy about killing Ben.
Apocalypses; 7,
Wheldon Cliches (with kind permission from Boo)
Scoobies in bondage: Spike in chains
Buffy: 9
Giles: 4
Cordy: 5
Will: 4
Jenny: 1
Angel: 4
Oz: 1
Faith: 3
Joyce: 1
Wes: 1
Xander; 3
Dawn; 4
Spike; 4
Scoobies knocked out: Poor Dawn although nothing is broken (at least Willow hopes so)
Buffy: 21
Giles: 12
Cordy: 6
Xander: 16
Will: 10
Jenny: 2
Angel: 6
Oz: 3
Faith: 1
Joyce: 3
Wes: 1
Anya;7
Dawn; 6
Tara; 1
Spike; 2
Kennedy; 1
Kills: 2 vamps for Spike (excluding his mum) and 2 for Buffy if we assume she finished off the vamp in the alley at the start
Buffy: 125 vamps, 62 demons, 6 monsters, 10 humans, 1 spirit warrior & a robot
Giles: 8 vamps, 2 demons, 2 humans/1 god.
Will: 6 vamps + 3 demons +1 fawn+1 human.
Oz: 3 vamps, 1 zombie, 1 werewolf,
Faith: 16 vamps, 5 demons, 3 humans
Xander: 6 vamps, 2 zombies, 1½ a demon, 2 humans
Anya: 1 vamp and 1½ a demon
Riley; 18 vamps + 7 demons
Spike; 11 vamps and 7 demons+1 human
Buffybot; 2 vamps
Tara; 1 demon
Dawn; 1 vamp + 1 demon
Kennedy; 1 human+1 vampire
Amanda; 1 vampire
Woods; 5 vamps and 2 demons
Scoobies go evil:
Giles: 1
Cordy: 1
Will: 4
Jenny: 1
Angel: 1
Oz: 1
Joyce: 1
Xander: 4
Anya; 1
Dawn; 1
Buffy; 1
Spike; 1
Wood; 1
Alternate scoobies:
Buffy: 8
Giles: 4
Cordy: 1
Will: 6
Jenny: 2
Angel: 3
Oz: 2
Joyce: 2
Xander: 4
Tara; 1
Dawn;1
Spike; 1
Anya; 2
Recurring characters killed: 15,
Jesse, Flutie, Jenny, Kendra, Larry, Snyder, Professor Walsh, Forrest, McNamara, Joyce, Katrina, Tara, Quentin Travers, Chloe, Jonathon.
Sunnydale deaths;
105
Total number of scoobies: 30 or so
Xander, Buffy, Dawn, Willow, Anya, Spike, Giles, Kennedy, Molly, Vi, Rhona, Amanda, Chao-Anh, Wood, Andrew plus an indeterminate number of potentials, at least a dozen or more.
Xander demon magnet: 6(7?)
Preying Mantis Lady, Inca Mummy Girl, Drusilla, VampWillow, Anya, Lissa (arguably Buffy & Faith with their demon essences?), Dracula?
Scoobies shot:
Giles: 2
Angel: 3
Oz: 4
Riley; 1
Buffy; 1
Tara; 1
Notches on Scooby bedpost:
Giles: 2; Joyce & Olivia, possibly Jenny and 3xDraccy babes?
Buffy: 4 confirmed; Angel, Parker, Riley, Spike. 3 possible, Dracula+RJ+Shadowmen's demon(?)
Joyce: 1;Giles, 2 possible, Ted and Dracula(?)
Oz: 3; Groupie, Willow & Verucca
Faith:2 ;Xander, Riley
Xander: 2; Faith, Anya
Willow: 2;Oz and Tara
Riley; 3; Buffy, Sandy and unnamed vampwhore
Spike; 2 Buffy and Anya
Anya; 2 Spike and Xander
Dawn in peril; 14
Dawn the bashful virgin; 9
What the fanficcers thought;
Questions and observations;
Buffy says she is now willing to sacrifice Dawn to save the world. Because she's older or because Buffy knows there's a heaven? Probably the latter as it's only after Giles remarks about what she's been through (death/afterlife) that she says it. She regards death as the reward for being human, the big dessert at the end of the meal. Or because Dawn is no longer her sole focus? She comments here that Dawn is 'tough'. Spike retains some of his humanity as a vampire (as the Judge senses in Becoming pt1), perhaps because of Dru's link to the PTB? When his mum is sick Spike suggests fetching Dr Gull which was also the name of Queen Victoria's physician and a popular suspect for Jack the Ripper but we've no proof it's the same guy. Willow recieves her phonecall from Fred in the Angel ep 'Orpheus'. Buffy still feels bad about how she treated her family and friends in 'Get it done', her punishment at the hands of the Shadowmen has actually benefitted her by bringing her to her senses in that regard, she's not so hardass any more. We really do have bad boy Spike back here, from now on he's the guy we know from seasons 2-4 but playing for the good guys. But deep down we know he'll always be William the Bloody (awful poet).
Nikki speaks of Robin liking playing with the 'Spooky doodas' at her Watcher's house. Does she mean the Shadow puppets we see in 'Get it Done'?
It speaks of Buffy's prowess as a Slayer that she can toy so effortlessly with the vamp whilst Giles talks to her. Does Spike mean what he says about not caring for Nikki or is this just revenge for his beating? Note both Spike and Angel(us) killed their mothers. Also although we don't see her use it Spike's mum has a wheelchair, no wonder he so hated being stuck in one for most of season 2.
So who's right? You've got to understand Wood's point, imagine if Spike had killed Joyce and went around wearing her coat as a trophy? Would anything on earth stop Buffy staking him? Or would he wake up on fire as Dawn promised? Again Wood is very similar to Holtz on Angel or Callisto on Xena. Note that Wood realises that souled Spike ISN'T the man who killed Nikki, he has to play 'Early one morning' to bring him out. Rare to have 2 eps with such a similar theme (Andrew and Spike's flashback filled redemption) in a row but it works fine.
Marks out of 10; 10/10 brilliant!
