The Night Lord
Wise-cracking Sidekick
The Long Kiss Goodnight
There can be no love. Only pain exists[Mo0:1]
Posts: 2,654
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Post by The Night Lord on Nov 26, 2009 0:39:18 GMT -5
Once you guys are done with beating each other up, we'll move back to the topic at hand and that is Angel vs Edward. Also, Sky, can I just point out that Eddy doesn't even have fangs! He just has sharp teeth, which is stupid imo, cuz all vampires have fangs. It's what makes them vampires and has been like that ever since vampires were created. Also, Edward could take Buffy? Seriously?? Well, maybe...actually, nah
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Post by buffyfan21 on Dec 11, 2009 10:52:19 GMT -5
Also, Edward could take Buffy? Seriously?? Well, maybe...actually, nah I can say one thing, Buffy would never fall for Edward's superficial charms, she's way too smart for that. Besides, she knows what real hot vampires are like.
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Randi Giles
Wise-cracking Sidekick
I Want to Believe
Moon Eyes in disguise.[Mo0:34]
Posts: 2,616
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Post by Randi Giles on Dec 24, 2009 15:56:58 GMT -5
Angel vs. Edward. LOL. LMAO. ROFL. Angel of course.
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batboy99
Potential Slayer
You're a little impressed, admit it.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 199
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Post by batboy99 on Dec 24, 2009 16:17:38 GMT -5
THis is awesome and he is so right. I personally think Twilight is mediocre at best. Thats even a little too nice.
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Post by Angel Beast on Dec 25, 2009 0:41:48 GMT -5
I'm inclined to agree with this shirt.
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Jaz ♀♀
Junior Vampire Slayer
Kisses & Gay Love
'Hey Lezallbefriendsbians!'[Mo0:30]
Posts: 941
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Post by Jaz ♀♀ on Dec 25, 2009 17:59:47 GMT -5
^^ that's a funny shirt!
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vampmogs
Novice Witch
[Mo0:16]
Posts: 208
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Post by vampmogs on Dec 25, 2009 20:41:59 GMT -5
I just wanted to say that I agree completely with Skytteflickan88 on this topic. If you’re debating who would win in a fight than IMO, your like/dislike of the books or characters should have no place in the discussion. I vastly prefer Angel as a character too but that doesn’t mean squat in regards to who would win in a battle. The vampires in the Twilight universe (I’ve read the first 3 books and seen both movies) are far stronger, faster and indestructible than the vampires in the Buffyverse. Edward could run much faster than Angel, he was stronger than Angel and his skin couldn’t be penetrated by swords or wooden stakes. It’s very likely that if you swung an axe at his head, it would shatter exactly like it did with Illyria at the start of Shells.
Now I don’t think it’s IMPOSSIBLE that Angel couldn’t beat Edward. We’ve seen both Buffy and Angel face opponents that are far superior to them in terms of strength, power and speed and they’ve won. But it would require some smart thinking, possibly some magical intervention and some help from their friends. Buffy would have lost against Glory if it weren’t for the Troll Hammer and Angelus only bested The Beast because he betrayed him. So in a straight up fight – no Angel could not beat Edward, but it’s a rarity that, that’s ever Buffy and Angel’s sole method anyway.
It also depends on how you look at it. I’m judging this based on the two universes and their separate rules and mythology. Now if you placed Edward in the Buffyverse and he was forced to suit how vampires are in that world, Angel would win. If Angel was placed in the Twilight Universe and handed all of their vampires capabilities, then Angel would win again. But if we were to look at both characters with the strengths and skills they both have, just as they are, then Edward wins.
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Post by Emmie on Dec 25, 2009 23:10:31 GMT -5
I just wanted to say that I agree completely with Skytteflickan88 on this topic. If you’re debating who would win in a fight than IMO, your like/dislike of the books or characters should have no place in the discussion. I vastly prefer Angel as a character too but that doesn’t mean squat in regards to who would win in a battle. The vampires in the Twilight universe (I’ve read the first 3 books and seen both movies) are far stronger, faster and indestructible than the vampires in the Buffyverse. Edward could run much faster than Angel, he was stronger than Angel and his skin couldn’t be penetrated by swords or wooden stakes. It’s very likely that if you swung an axe at his head, it would shatter exactly like it did with Illyria at the start of Shells. But here's the deal. They're both vampires. So they're by definition the same. Now if you also view them as being from different universes, then think of it like Superman being all powerful on Earth but just normal on Krypton. The difference means that the Twilight vampires are that strong in their own world. But in the Buffyverse world, where they would still be vampires, they'd be the same power level. So the joint definition for a crossover would be simply "vampire". If Angel went over to Twilight, he'd have the powers of the vampires in the Twilight 'verse. If Edward went over to the Buffyverse, he'd have the powers of a vampire in the Buffyverse. Comparatively, Illyria as a God-King would be more powerful than Edward Cullen because vampires are not gods in the Twilight 'verse - so for her to be qualified as a God, she'd have to be more powerful than him. You can't compare contexts of two different universes and treat them like they're the same worlds. It just doesn't work that straightforwardly imo. The most relevant comparison to me is that Angel is a warrior who has battled beings far more powerful than him. Pretty much ALL vampires fear him. Compare this to Edward - he strikes fear in who? Definitely not the bad ass vampire society that rules over all the vampires. Add on that he's not a warrior at all really and meh.
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nickclark89
Common Vampire
Watching....[Mo0:0]
Posts: 62
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Post by nickclark89 on Dec 25, 2009 23:50:29 GMT -5
The vampires in the Twilight universe (I’ve read the first 3 books and seen both movies) are far stronger, faster and indestructible than the vampires in the Buffyverse. Edward could run much faster than Angel, he was stronger than Angel and his skin couldn’t be penetrated by swords or wooden stakes. I put proofs that Angel can be just as strong and fast as Edward, and the granite skin can be broken easily by the superstrength (Angel has achieved that The Beast kneel facing him, and he not only has the skin of granite, it's a colossus made entirely of rock and magma). EDIT: I almost forget, some time ago I investigated the "Twilight Wikia", long before this topic, the skin of the vampires of Meyers are very flammable, perhaps the simple barrel of a bullet would burn them, or better, flamethrowers for humans. They aren't invulnerable and indestructible as you want to give understand. You CAN NOT compare to Illyria with a vampire of Meyers, for the goddes.... Ow, I've read the second book, and 115 pages of Eclipse (4. Nature, tomorrow the chapter 5 onwards), has not made me think otherwise. (I'm taking advantage of the Christmas holidays ) The thing is the weak Bella's perspective has a big contrast opposite its supernatural world.
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Post by Skytteflickan88 on Dec 26, 2009 6:29:36 GMT -5
But here's the deal. They're both vampires. So they're by definition the same. Now if you also view them as being from different universes, then think of it like Superman being all powerful on Earth but just normal on Krypton. The difference means that the Twilight vampires are that strong in their own world. But in the Buffyverse world, where they would still be vampires, they'd be the same power level. So the joint definition for a crossover would be simply "vampire". If Angel went over to Twilight, he'd have the powers of the vampires in the Twilight 'verse. If Edward went over to the Buffyverse, he'd have the powers of a vampire in the Buffyverse. Comparatively, Illyria as a God-King would be more powerful than Edward Cullen because vampires are not gods in the Twilight 'verse - so for her to be qualified as a God, she'd have to be more powerful than him. You can't compare contexts of two different universes and treat them like they're the same worlds. It just doesn't work that straightforwardly imo. That's just it, they're not the same worlds. So in case there was a giant portal opening and one character stepped into another one, that character's power would change? Even tough there's been no mention of people jumping portals losing their powers? There's of course Glory, but she was forced to live inside a human and didn't exacly just buy a ticket to another world. I very much doubt that Edward would just turn into another specie because he stepped into another world, I mean that would mean that he wouldn't be a vampire at all in Angel's world, since he wasn't even turned the same way. Even tough they're both called vampires, that doesn't make them the same, and it doesn't mean they will naturaly change to fit into another world's definition of a creature with the same name. And about Illyria. You say she would have to be more powerful that Edward in his universe because there are not Gods there? How do you know she wouldn't be powerless there, because of the lack of Gods? Maybe she should cease to exist in his world, because that's the rules of the Twilightverse. However, I'm inclined to believe that in case there was ever a crossover, there would need to be a special portal or spell done to change the one's who crossed over. Of course, we're just guessing, all of us. Btw, thanks for writing that post. It's rare these days that I find a good post that makes me think and discuss, since I'm always behind on the comics and can't discuss them. EDIT- Once you guys are done with beating each other up, we'll move back to the topic at hand and that is Angel vs Edward. Also, Sky, can I just point out that Eddy doesn't even have fangs! He just has sharp teeth, which is stupid imo, cuz all vampires have fangs. It's what makes them vampires and has been like that ever since vampires were created. Also, Edward could take Buffy? Seriously?? Well, maybe...actually, nah I wouldn't qualify our "battle" as off topic, considering that it's still about comparing one verse against another. But I'll bite. *wink wink* I gotta say I prefer fanged vamps too, wherter they're brough out with the game face or human teeth extra sharp, but I don't see what it has to do with this argument, since the power isn't in the fangs. What makes a vampire a vampire sounds like another discussion entirely. I'm speaking about strength, speed and the ability to fight, not about what's stupid. I think Kennedy's attitude problems are stupid, but I still wouldn't say that she couldn't beat Angel because of that.
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Post by buffyfan21 on Dec 27, 2009 12:57:44 GMT -5
I'm inclined to agree with this shirt. OMG, I totally want this shirt! ;D
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vampmogs
Novice Witch
[Mo0:16]
Posts: 208
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Post by vampmogs on Dec 27, 2009 21:59:05 GMT -5
Emmie, I understand your point and I think that’s one way to look at it but IMO it’s not the only way. To be honest when I think of a crossover, I usually think of taking both characters *as they are* and battling them against each other. That’s why in reality a Buffy/Twilight crossover could never work because their mythologies contradict one another. So I tend to take both characters, with their own skills and weaknesses, and place them against each other. If I looked at it like you then I agree that Angel would win. However, if I looked at it with both characters retaining their skills and abilities, then Edward wins. I think it’s a little unfair to not take both vampires as how they are and pit themselves against one another. Especially when people constantly pay Twilight-Vampires out as being wimps when in reality they’re nearly indestructible and very deadly – sparkling aside Oh and just to clarify – I wasn’t necessarily saying that Edward was as strong as Illyria, I was just using the axe-shattering moment as an example as to what were to happen to him if someone swung an axe at his head. Whereas, it would decapitate Angel quite easily. I put proofs that Angel can be just as strong and fast as Edward, and the granite skin can be broken easily by the superstrength Angel isn't as fast as Edward, I'm sorry but I'm not even going to debate this. It's said that Edward can cross entire states in a matter of hours. Angel is not that fast and he never has been. When the Twilight vampires fight they move so fast that a human can't see anything but a blur. Whereas humans are perfectly capable of seeing vampires fight in the Buffyverse and are also capable of fighting against them. In Twilight a human doesn't have a chance in hell of blocking or evading an attack from a vampire because they move too quick, whereas in BtVS regular humans like Xander and Riley often fight hand-to-hand against vampires and managed to evade and block their kicks and punches. The vampires in Twilight are obviously faster. In regards to Angel fighting the Beast, NEVER, did he break the Beast’s skin. He managed to bring it down to its knees but that was all. The text states that the only thing that can penetrate through the Beast’s skin is “a piece of himself” which is why Angelus stabs him in the back with the dagger made out of the Beast. That’s explicitly stated in the script. Vampires in the Buffyverse are also extremely flammable. Angel says so himself in Lonely Hearts and it's been shown in numerous episodes. Though I would like to add that in the Twilight movie, in order to kill the vampire James the Cullen's have to "rip him apart AND burn the pieces" which means doing just one of these isn't sufficient. You must rip them apart AND burn them. I never said they were. I said they *basically* were, at least in comparison to Buffyverse vampires.
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Post by Angel Beast on Dec 28, 2009 11:44:08 GMT -5
Edward may be fast but thats not going to make him better then Angel. It's like saying the Flash is better then Superman cause he can run around the world in no time. Edward's speed I think would be his downfall in a fight with Angel. Angel is clever and would figure out a way to use Edward's speed against him. That or he would get help from Willow, seeing as Wes is dead, to come up with a spell to slow him down.
And the only thing I see Edward beating Angel in is baseball.
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nickclark89
Common Vampire
Watching....[Mo0:0]
Posts: 62
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Post by nickclark89 on Dec 28, 2009 13:16:00 GMT -5
vampmogs, I quote myself. Other example: The doors's car are closed and remain closed when he's went, he's gone so fast that neither Lilah noticed of that. Edward is a blur, but Angel seems that he teleports. The super speed on Buffyverse exist, but rarely shown. I know that vampire on Whedonverse are flammable, I just say that vampire on Twilight are extremely flammables too, even more, Angel needed gasoline to set fire to Darla and Drusilla, and they still not turned into ashes, Spike received numerous blows of fire and not burned click here, however Meyers vampires have in the skin a highly flammable substance. The rest are precautionary measures. Whereas humans are perfectly capable of seeing vampires fight in the Buffyverse and are also capable of fighting against them. How many times do I have to say that Buffy and Angel often shows inconsistencies in their characters' physical strength and speed. This has been acknowledged frequently in commentaries and interviews by writers and creators of the shows. I just said that he was able to bring him down, not defeat him, then that is why Angel can defeat a vampire from Meyers, who are infinitely more inferior to him (The Beast), the only thing that makes them strong is his defense of their skin, easily breakable by super strength. You never said they were, but you want to give understand they are.
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Randi Giles
Wise-cracking Sidekick
I Want to Believe
Moon Eyes in disguise.[Mo0:34]
Posts: 2,616
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Post by Randi Giles on Dec 28, 2009 14:46:59 GMT -5
The super speed on Buffyverse exist, but rarely shown. I was going also going to bring that up. There are plenty of scenes like that in both Buffy and Angel where he or Spike appear quickly. Besides don't vampires in the Buffyverse have martial art skills that Angel clearly displays. After watching Twilight and New Moon speed is probably about the only thing Edward has on Angel. I don't think he one of the strongest fighting vampires rather he's in the Buffyverse world, Twilight world or whatever. I like Edward I just don't think he's much of a fighter. If Angel has to rip Edward apart and burn him to defeat him I think it's possible since we seen him do it to more than dozens of demons.
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Post by Skytteflickan88 on Dec 28, 2009 14:56:36 GMT -5
Edward may be fast but thats not going to make him better then Angel. It's like saying the Flash is better then Superman cause he can run around the world in no time. Edward's speed I think would be his downfall in a fight with Angel. Angel is clever and would figure out a way to use Edward's speed against him. That or he would get help from Willow, seeing as Wes is dead, to come up with a spell to slow him down. And the only thing I see Edward beating Angel in is baseball. The things is, I doubt Angel is smart enough to be able to figure out a strategy before Edward has ripped him apart. But if Angel got time, and was able to cheat, using Willow, he would have a shot. Maybe he could talk to Edward while Willow worked a spell, keep him busy. Of course, Alice might have tipped Edward of about that and he kills Willow and Angel within a sec, if even that.
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Randi Giles
Wise-cracking Sidekick
I Want to Believe
Moon Eyes in disguise.[Mo0:34]
Posts: 2,616
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Post by Randi Giles on Dec 28, 2009 15:06:14 GMT -5
Edward may be fast but thats not going to make him better then Angel. It's like saying the Flash is better then Superman cause he can run around the world in no time. Edward's speed I think would be his downfall in a fight with Angel. Angel is clever and would figure out a way to use Edward's speed against him. That or he would get help from Willow, seeing as Wes is dead, to come up with a spell to slow him down. And the only thing I see Edward beating Angel in is baseball. The things is, I doubt Angel is smart enough to be able to figure out a strategy before Edward has ripped him apart. But if Angel got time, and was able to cheat, using Willow, he would have a shot. Maybe he could talk to Edward while Willow worked a spell, keep him busy. Of course, Alice might have tipped Edward of about that and he kills Willow and Angel within a sec, if even that. If there's outside interference well then it's anybodys game. Alice could try to tip Edward off. Or Willow can just skin her. So I don't really care for it all. No Willow. No Alice. Just Edward vs. Angel.
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nickclark89
Common Vampire
Watching....[Mo0:0]
Posts: 62
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Post by nickclark89 on Dec 28, 2009 18:09:24 GMT -5
Well, Alice's visions aren't as accurate as most believe, anyway, I just finished "Eclipse", Skytteflickan88, the scene of the tree that you mentioned hasn't shown on the book.... Edward throw to Victoria to a tree, the first time nothing happens, to the second time, the tree is broken... is that it extraordinary for a vampire? , whatever, Victoria is very cool , but I don't liked the end . The only thing I liked was that Seth participates at his end. That yes, the book seems a travesty to great vampire books.
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Post by Angel Beast on Dec 28, 2009 21:06:01 GMT -5
Edward may be fast but thats not going to make him better then Angel. It's like saying the Flash is better then Superman cause he can run around the world in no time. Edward's speed I think would be his downfall in a fight with Angel. Angel is clever and would figure out a way to use Edward's speed against him. That or he would get help from Willow, seeing as Wes is dead, to come up with a spell to slow him down. And the only thing I see Edward beating Angel in is baseball. The things is, I doubt Angel is smart enough to be able to figure out a strategy before Edward has ripped him apart. But if Angel got time, and was able to cheat, using Willow, he would have a shot. Maybe he could talk to Edward while Willow worked a spell, keep him busy. Of course, Alice might have tipped Edward of about that and he kills Willow and Angel within a sec, if even that. I don't think Edward would get the chance to come close to ripping Angel apart. Angel will be able to reverse Edward. Their first encounter would most likely end in a stalemate. Angel would then take the time to come up with the plan to execute and take out Edward.
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Post by Skytteflickan88 on Dec 31, 2009 10:19:20 GMT -5
Well, Alice's visions aren't as accurate as most believe, anyway, I just finished "Eclipse", Skytteflickan88, the scene of the tree that you mentioned hasn't shown on the book.... Edward throw to Victoria to a tree, the first time nothing happens, to the second time, the tree is broken... is that it extraordinary for a vampire? I did a quick read of the chapter where they fought, and you seem to be right. So of my three arguments *Edward is stronger *Edward is faster *Edward's body/skin is stronger one I can't "prove", since I can't remember a scene that would prove that Twilight-vamps are stronger than Buffyverse-vamps.
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