Ben; good or bad?

[Saturn 5]

We're currently discussing The Gift on the Buffytube part of the forum. It's virtually universally accepted that it was right for Giles to kill him but is Ben evil?

I'm not sure he is. He becomes a doctor to help people, he risks his life to help Buffy and co in spiral. He kills the patients in Quelled but you could argue this was an act of mercy. He protects and tries to rescue Dawn

His true colours come out in The Gift when he's prepared to let everyone else die in return for living forever as Glory's right hand man in hell (in stark contrast to Buffy and Dawn who are both prepared to sacrifice themselves to save the world).
Ultimately I think Dawn is right, he's a monster but a monster created by horrific circumstances that weren't his doing

[Skytteflickan88]

I'm not sure in case it was all Ben in The Gift. He and Glory was melting, so to speak. Maybe earlier in the season, he wouldn't have done it.

Or maybe he would have.

I keep feeling that if he had the choice, he would live a nice normal life. But that doesn't take away from the fact that in case he'd killed himself, or asked someome to kill him, so many lives and minds could have been saved. Maybe he thought Glory couldn't be killed and that's why they're still alive. Maybe Glory had enough power to stop him from offing himself.

It's hard to know who he would have been, in case he hadn't had Glory in him. But in in The Gift I don't call him evil. He just wanted to survive. He's a coward, and Giles did right to kill him, but he's not evil.

[Saturn 5]

Yeah, that is one argument, that Glory is blending into Ben and vice versa which is why Glory is relatively nice to Dawn.

[zamolxis]

Nov 21, 2009 6:00:37 GMT -5 Saturn 5 said:

He kills the patients in Quelled but you could argue this was an act of mercy.

Those people were innocents, they had families who would take care of them. Would it be still considered an act of mercy if Tara was killed in the hospital by that creature? Sorry, there is no argument here. It was a bad thing to do and Ben did it to cover Glory's acts and to remove any possible links between him and her.

[Randi Giles]

Nov 21, 2009 9:03:21 GMT -5 zamolxis said:

Nov 21, 2009 6:00:37 GMT -5 Saturn 5 said:

He kills the patients in Quelled but you could argue this was an act of mercy.

Those people were innocents, they had families who would take care of them. Would it be still considered an act of mercy if Tara was killed in the hospital by that creature? Sorry, there is no argument here. It was a bad thing to do and Ben did it to cover Glory's acts and to remove any possible links between him and her.

I guess this is true. I always took it as Ben just panicking because his life was fading before his eyes. And you know that always suck. He was just dealt a bad hand and I think he was a good guy that just kept making alot of stupid and bad choices. Until the end when I believe Glory did start to blend.

[hellmouth]

In times of pressure and stress peoples true colors shine through. Ben's ultimate motives were self preservation. I don't think he liked the other people getting hurt but his attitude was definitely better you than me. That is what makes Buffy so different. She is constantly putting herself in harms way to protect others.

[Jaz ♀♀]

i think Ben falls under the "grey area" catagory....just like quite a few other demons you see in the Buffyverse....he wasn't necessarily evil-y bad, i mean he did try to dedicate his life to helping people, tried to save Dawn from Glory and helped the Scoobies in Spiral...and all he wanted was a normal life but got stuck with sharing his body with a hell god....i think he did what most people would have done when they're at a crossroad, he panic and chose his life over others...and that's what definitely makes him different than Buffy and the other Scoobies for that matter...he wasn't strong enough to sacrifice himself wherein Buffy has...quite a few times.

In the end, he, like a lot of other people, ended up making the wrong choice....i don't think he should be dubbed as "bad"...but he wasn't exactly a saint either....

[Darth Rosie]

Ben: tragic.

[Tea - Total]

Its very different , but i like it , very unpredictable.
Good.

I like how that a human cant contain the true identity of a god.
Excellent