Cover?

[hitnrun017]

Could this be a cover for another issue? It was with the Issue 17 covers at this link, but there is no caption for it.

www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=16059

[El Diablo Robotico]

I noticed that, but there was no caption so I just thought it was an ad and didn't look closely at it. But she does look a little like Buffy, and she's holding a stake, so it's probably not some completely un-related ad, after all.

With the old-fashioned outfit, and the infinity symbol over her head, I wonder if that's supposed to be not Buffy, but rather just a general depiction of the Slayer, a warrior through the ages who has always existed and always will exist.

But if it's a variant cover (they did three different covers for #5, remember), why oh why couldn't they have gotten Karl Moline to do it... ?

[Rebecca]

This "cover" as I am presuming it to be looks very Judeo-christian, until you notice the pentagram on the table.

This definitely looks like Buffy, but what's with all the symbolism? It looks completely unrelated to the Fray arc.

Just the style of the piece makes me want to pick apart the symbols and try to get some meaning out of it.

We see on the girl's person
- Laurel crown: a signal of great power and authority
- a red draping cloak similar to the one Jesus wore at his cruxifiction, not to go too far. But the color red has many associations: love, passion, anger, heat, fire, and blood. Note that it is at the center of the piece, and is meant to draw your eye.
- a golden snake belt that reminds me so much of Cleopatra... the snake is the symbol of life throwing off the past and continuing to live.
- a wooden stake, makes me believe that is a slayer, if not Buffy herself
- a sword. Not the scythe, but a sword on her side. Swords symbolize war, aggression, and power
- she's also barefoot, a symbol of peace, innocence, poverty, and mourning.

Around the girl
- an infinity symbol above her... immortality? or as El Diablo Robotico said earlier, the spirit of the slayers?
- on the left, a bush of red roses. They typically symbolize love, but they also symbolize courage and respect.
- on the right, a table with a pentogram and a golden chalice. In Wicca, a chalice is a feminine symbol, which, on the pentogram, it's hard to take as otherwise.


What do you make of it?

[hitnrun017]

There is too much going on here. I can't come up with anything. Nice details onemoretouch! She also seems to be pointing at the roses.

[Rebecca]

Oh yeah! I didn't catch that. Perhaps she is petitioning for others to show courage and respect.

Typically in art I would say the painter was trying to convey that to the viewer, however in the literary sense, Buffy may be "speaking" to her slayers and/or friends and/or enemies.

[faith0tvs]

The Pencils and the Colors remind me of an ElGreco painting

[Rebecca]

Perhaps it was modeled from a historical piece?

[Rebecca]

lol... not exact, but similar


I'm still looking

[Emmie]

I think its interesting that she has a white sheath on underneath the red robe. Like she's covered in blood from battle but it doesn't stain the purity within.

Thanks for the insights, Onemoretouch.

[wenxina]

Apr 18, 2008 13:36:57 GMT -5 Rebecca said:

This "cover" as I am presuming it to be looks very Judeo-christian, until you notice the pentagram on the table.

This definitely looks like Buffy, but what's with all the symbolism? It looks completely unrelated to the Fray arc.

Just the style of the piece makes me want to pick apart the symbols and try to get some meaning out of it.

We see on the girl's person
- Laurel crown: a signal of great power and authority
- a red draping cloak similar to the one Jesus wore at his cruxifiction, not to go too far. But the color red has many associations: love, passion, anger, heat, fire, and blood. Note that it is at the center of the piece, and is meant to draw your eye.
- a golden snake belt that reminds me so much of Cleopatra... the snake is the symbol of life throwing off the past and continuing to live.
- a wooden stake, makes me believe that is a slayer, if not Buffy herself
- a sword. Not the scythe, but a sword on her side. Swords symbolize war, aggression, and power
- she's also barefoot, a symbol of peace, innocence, poverty, and mourning.

Around the girl
- an infinity symbol above her... immortality? or as El Diablo Robotico said earlier, the spirit of the slayers?
- on the left, a bush of red roses. They typically symbolize love, but they also symbolize courage and respect.
- on the right, a table with a pentogram and a golden chalice. In Wicca, a chalice is a feminine symbol, which, on the pentogram, it's hard to take as otherwise.


What do you make of it?

I agree for the most part, but a couple of other thoughts hit me while I studied the composition of the piece. The style is definitely reminiscent of many religious paintings, but it's a deliberate perversion IMO.

For one, laurel wreaths were typically honored to Olympic athletes, and victors of competitions, but only men were allowed to compete in those events. This is clearly not a man... she does bear some resemblance to Buffy, but that could be intentional, more than anything else.

For another, if this is a painting done in the stlye of Judeo-Christian tradition, the presence of a snake would not be seen as the things you listed. While the ancient Greeks, Egyptians and Indians (from India) saw snakes as creatures of deep worship, or at least representative of the earth (Greek), the Book of Genesis is less forgiving in it's depiction of the snake as the first evil that visits man. The snake is the deceiver, and this woman wears it wrapped around her being. Quasi-biblical reference, maybe?

These two points taken together could be representative of how some individuals may view Buffy, and her slayer army. Women who have usurped the place of men, wrapped in lies.
Heck, to hear General Voll tell it, Buffy's the equivalent of the whore of Babylon... another depiction of a warrior woman.

Three, the sword mentioned is sheathed, not raised. It's the stake that's raised. So maybe not so much with the warcry. Rather, it brings to mind Buffy's question to the Potentials: "Are you ready to be strong?" But strong to do what? To defend what's true? To defend the roses? I agree with the rest. Being barefoot can be a symbol of innocence and peace... which would counteract the symbol of the sword. As the sword is sheathed, it can be interpreted as the true meaning of the slayer: not a killer, but a protector of the people. In that case, the previous imagery makes even more sense, as the laurel wreath marks her as a champion of the people (you already mentioned this), the snake marks her as being of the earth, and the raised stake is her mark.

Just some thoughts, but kudos on your detailed take on it.
Whether or not it's a variant, it's definitely generated some interesting conversation. If it's got to be a variant, I'd like it to perhaps be the last book in the Buffy/Fray arc... it's essentially the depiction of the slayer, not just any one person. If this arc takes us closer to understanding the events that will lead to Fray's future, the history of the slayer and Scythe may be involved, and this would make a fitting cover then. But whatever...

EDIT: Read on Whedonesque, and my boyfriend confirmed the possibility that the image is reminiscent of a tarot card.

[themaleslayer]

don't tell me she goes to Rome

[Rebecca]

Yes, I definitely had a perversion of Judeo-Christian take on this, you just worded it better!!!

Thanks for that better analysis.

There still lies in the question as to why she is pointing to the roses though

[Rachster]

looks like a secret message or clue about the big battle thats coming

And thanks wenxina and onemoretouch for the detailed posts there really helpful

[iloveromy]

that symbol above buffy's head? Was that symbol in the Restless episode? When Tara holds out the Tarot card. It was on the MANUS THE HAND? I can't remember.

[Emmie]

In the Judeo-Christian context, red roses symbolize martyrdom and the blood of Christ. Could her pointing to the rose be a signal to the slayer's purpose - to martyr herself in order to save humanity? The warrior martyr.

Roses represent love, courage and respect. Roses are seen as one of the most prominent metaphors for love and life.

I think almost everyone would say love is the meaning of red roses, but aren't they also one of the greatest gifts. They are given as a message of love.

So the slayer, the warrior martyr, points to the red rose bush perhaps saying she fights and sacrifices herself out of love. Its her gift.

[Rowan Hawthorn]

Go here:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Major_01.jpg

ETA: crap, the link didn't work.

Go here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rider-Waite-Smith_deck

and click on card #1, Magician or Juggler

[El Diablo Robotico]

Wow, onemoretouch and wenxina, you're both wicked smart!!

I just wish we knew what this thing was, whether it really is a cover or not. I just noticed that if you follow the link in the first post to the CBR story, it doesn't appear to be there anymore--just the Chen and Jeanty covers...

[Emmie]

Nice catch there, Rowan.

Just thought I'd post the text from this site about the images of the Magician:
________________________________________________________________________________________

Esoteric Significance

Some frequent keywords are:

* Action — Consciousness — Concentration — Personal power

* Practicality — Energy — Creativity — Movement

* Precision — Conviction — Manipulation — Self confidence

* Being objective — Focusing — Determination — Initiative

A youthful figure in the robe of a magician has the face of the divine Apollo, the sun god, with a confident smile and shining eyes. Above his head is the mysterious sign of the Holy Spirit, the sign of life, like an endless cord, forming the lemniscate of infinity. About his waist is a serpent-cincture or girdle, the ouroboros, the serpent devouring its own tail. The ouroboros is an ancient symbol of eternity, eternal becoming or transmutation and transformation, but in this case it indicates more especially the eternity of attainment in the spirit. In the Magician's right hand is a wand raised towards heaven, the sky or the element æther, whilst the left hand is pointing to the earth. This iconographic gesture has multiple meanings, but is endemic to the Mysteries, symbolising divine immanence, the ability of the magician to bridge the gap between heaven and earth. On the table in front of the Magician the symbols of the four Tarot suits signify the Classical elements of earth, air, fire and water. Beneath are roses and lilies, the flos campi and lilium convallium, changed into garden flowers, to show the culture of aspiration.

Divination

When the Magician appears in a spread, it points to the talents, capabilities and resources at the sitter's disposal. Depending on the card's placement in relation to other cards, the message is to tap into one's full potential rather than holding back, especially when there's a need to transform something. There are choices and directions to take. Guidance can arrive through one's own intuition or in the form of someone who brings about change or transformation.

It can mean a manipulator is floating around, usually if it's reversed. He may be a beneficent guide, but he does not necessarily have our best interests in mind. He may also represent the querent’s ego or self awareness. He can also represent the intoxication of power, good and bad.

(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Magician_%28Tarot_card%29)

_____________________________________________________________________________________

"It can mean a manipulator is floating around, usually if it's reversed." WHAT? lol yes it all starts to fit in with the Twilight the Manipulator Thread!

So it seems like the eternity symbol means that the cover is the slayer spirit.

[wenxina]

I completely forgot about the snake devouring itself. I was think about that on my way home today, but it got left out of the post. Thanks Rowan and Emmie for showing the way. Hey, isn't there a Buffy deck game or sorts? Possibly a special card for the deck?

[Rebecca]

Apr 18, 2008 22:35:23 GMT -5 Emmie said:

Nice catch there, Rowan.

Just thought I'd post the text from this site about the images of the Magician:
________________________________________________________________________________________

Esoteric Significance

Some frequent keywords are:

* Action — Consciousness — Concentration — Personal power

* Practicality — Energy — Creativity — Movement

* Precision — Conviction — Manipulation — Self confidence

* Being objective — Focusing — Determination — Initiative

A youthful figure in the robe of a magician has the face of the divine Apollo, the sun god, with a confident smile and shining eyes. Above his head is the mysterious sign of the Holy Spirit, the sign of life, like an endless cord, forming the lemniscate of infinity. About his waist is a serpent-cincture or girdle, the ouroboros, the serpent devouring its own tail. The ouroboros is an ancient symbol of eternity, eternal becoming or transmutation and transformation, but in this case it indicates more especially the eternity of attainment in the spirit. In the Magician's right hand is a wand raised towards heaven, the sky or the element æther, whilst the left hand is pointing to the earth. This iconographic gesture has multiple meanings, but is endemic to the Mysteries, symbolising divine immanence, the ability of the magician to bridge the gap between heaven and earth. On the table in front of the Magician the symbols of the four Tarot suits signify the Classical elements of earth, air, fire and water. Beneath are roses and lilies, the flos campi and lilium convallium, changed into garden flowers, to show the culture of aspiration.

Divination

When the Magician appears in a spread, it points to the talents, capabilities and resources at the sitter's disposal. Depending on the card's placement in relation to other cards, the message is to tap into one's full potential rather than holding back, especially when there's a need to transform something. There are choices and directions to take. Guidance can arrive through one's own intuition or in the form of someone who brings about change or transformation.

It can mean a manipulator is floating around, usually if it's reversed. He may be a beneficent guide, but he does not necessarily have our best interests in mind. He may also represent the querent’s ego or self awareness. He can also represent the intoxication of power, good and bad.

(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Magician_%28Tarot_card%29)

_____________________________________________________________________________________

"It can mean a manipulator is floating around, usually if it's reversed." WHAT? lol yes it all starts to fit in with the Twilight the Manipulator Thread!

So it seems like the eternity symbol means that the cover is the slayer spirit.

Oh. My. God. This is brilliant. Such an insight into Twilight.

Also REALLY SIGNIFICANT now that the "cover" is no longer up on the link's website. It's really awesome that we caught this before it was taken off. Wonder why it was