D'Hoffryn
Potential Slayer
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 127
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Post by D'Hoffryn on Nov 28, 2008 12:14:22 GMT -5
Wow finally got mine today and like most i guessed FDW was gonna cop it. I would of like to see what FDW showed fray but i guess that will happen at issue 40 something in the finale. I hope that FDW isn't dead that the last of her dark magic heals her and if they make a new fray series were she is her watcher, or living through 200 years of history and her experiences with buffy makes Fray a whole slayer acting as her connection to the slayer dreams which Harth has. For the future i see kenneddy and satsu getting close especially if she wants payback for willows thing with snake lady (maybe she finds out and needs space, thus goes to japan)
Finally if we don't get a Buffy movie they should make Fray into one, you don't need to of watched buffy to understand it and i think it would bring hundreds of thousands of new people into the buffy-verse and make them watch buffy and angel.
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Post by Tyler Austin "tiewashere" on Nov 28, 2008 12:40:30 GMT -5
So, does everyone else think that Buffy will TRY and stop the future from coming forth, and then it will?
Also, was the "someone will turn on you" already proven true? Was it Willow in the future? Or Willow in the present? Who is really the same Willow...but if you get what I'm saying lol
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D'Hoffryn
Potential Slayer
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 127
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Post by D'Hoffryn on Nov 28, 2008 12:59:08 GMT -5
OK i have just read it again and i think i understand it.
Magic was sealed away by someone in the past.
ALL Magic was sealed away within willow (for she is a magical sponge)
Buffy was part of the ritual were she is the only one who can break the spell and release it after they win and twighlight is destroyed. BUT......... Something bad happens to buffy were she won't or can't kill willow so FDW knows frays time needs magic to help it get better therefore FDW plots her own death and forces buffy's hand and the age of magic can return. well thats my opinion
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witcher
Wise-cracking Techno Genius
Homicidal Bunny
Willow fan forever[Mo0:30]
Posts: 711
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Post by witcher on Nov 28, 2008 14:38:19 GMT -5
OK i have just read it again and i think i understand it. Magic was sealed away by someone in the past. ALL Magic was sealed away within willow (for she is a magical sponge) Buffy was part of the ritual were she is the only one who can break the spell and release it after they win and twighlight is destroyed. BUT......... Something bad happens to buffy were she won't or can't kill willow so FDW knows frays time needs magic to help it get better therefore FDW plots her own death and forces buffy's hand and the age of magic can return. well thats my opinion Hmm I like this theory its new and I'll give you points for originality, but if its so what happened in the future that wants to make Willow bring back magic, if they decided that world was better of without it. Also it was said that all magic were banished including demons, vampires... So did you think that Willow absorbed their mojo too, or were they banished and Willow just sucked magic from witches, wizards... Its a nice idea, and I would love too see it happened but there are, at this point, to many plot-holes.
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Post by hitnrun017 on Nov 28, 2008 16:24:02 GMT -5
Just thought of something that's bothering me. In Part 2 we see that a bunch of lurks are taking humans off the streets and that Harth is behind it. FDW says that his schemes are "ingenious" and Harth says "it's going to be quite a battle." There was nothing that cleared any of this up.
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Whedon Fan
Ensouled Vampire
Joss Is Boss
Banner & Avatar Made By CBG[Mo0:3][Mo0:3]
Posts: 1,312
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Post by Whedon Fan on Nov 28, 2008 16:47:00 GMT -5
Just thought of something that's bothering me. In Part 2 we see that a bunch of lurks are taking humans off the streets and that Harth is behind it. FDW says that his schemes are "ingenious" and Harth says "it's going to be quite a battle." There was nothing that cleared any of this up. Oh yeah. I wonder what it was. Probably just making more vamps (lurks) for the battle but it's not very "ingenious" just another plain old vampire tac tic. Maybe something Joss set up and purposley left open for the hopefully one day Fray series sequel. Either that or I'm betting with the huge delay Joss just forgot about it...
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Post by hitnrun017 on Nov 28, 2008 17:24:32 GMT -5
Just thought of something that's bothering me. In Part 2 we see that a bunch of lurks are taking humans off the streets and that Harth is behind it. FDW says that his schemes are "ingenious" and Harth says "it's going to be quite a battle." There was nothing that cleared any of this up. Oh yeah. I wonder what it was. Probably just making more vamps (lurks) for the battle but it's not very "ingenious" just another plain old vampire tac tic. Maybe something Joss set up and purposley left open for the hopefully one day Fray series sequel. Either that or I'm betting with the huge delay Joss just forgot about it... Yeah, those are two things I ran by in my head. Since a Fray sequel is probably years off, why start it now? So I'm also betting that Joss just forgot. It's kind of annoying if that's what happened, but with all the projects he has running through his brain right now, he can't be faulted too badly.
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dane5by5
Wise-cracking Techno Genius
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 734
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Post by dane5by5 on Nov 28, 2008 18:14:50 GMT -5
Oh yeah. I wonder what it was. Probably just making more vamps (lurks) for the battle but it's not very "ingenious" just another plain old vampire tac tic. Maybe something Joss set up and purposley left open for the hopefully one day Fray series sequel. Either that or I'm betting with the huge delay Joss just forgot about it... Yeah, those are two things I ran by in my head. Since a Fray sequel is probably years off, why start it now? So I'm also betting that Joss just forgot. It's kind of annoying if that's what happened, but with all the projects he has running through his brain right now, he can't be faulted too badly. It's sad that if this storyline is every followed up, it will be years from now. Although it could have just been FDW pandering to Harth's ego, telling what a smart idea it was. When in fact, she was just getting him on side. The only other thing I can think of, was Harth was herding all these people to turn, so he would have an army of vampires. Not many vampires in the Buffyverse have done this, so it does seem ingenious in comparison to your regular, hunt and feed, hunt and feed, kind of vampires.
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Post by Emmie on Nov 28, 2008 19:32:44 GMT -5
Just thought of something that's bothering me. In Part 2 we see that a bunch of lurks are taking humans off the streets and that Harth is behind it. FDW says that his schemes are "ingenious" and Harth says "it's going to be quite a battle." There was nothing that cleared any of this up. It's probably foreshadowing for future Fray stories. Allie has said there has been serious discussion about them, just no plans in the near future. But someday, it will most likely happen. Harth is actually very ingenious to me. He's organized the vampires into a huge and structured mob. This is very different from the loner vampires we often have seen in the Buffyverse. I get the impression that Harth's crew greatly outnumbers even the Order of Aurelius (the tightly knit family members who actually lived together) who were seen together in the first season of Buffy. Plus vampires are more about 'ravage, kill, feed' so Harth's method is highly organized and tactical. He's reigning in the "Want. Take. Have." of the vampire hordes which is pretty damned impressive. Dane makes a great point. I'd also interpreted that (in hindsight of reading #19) as Willow pandering to Harth's ego to manipulate him.
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darthrosenberg9
Potential Slayer
"You haven?t seen my drawer of inappropriate starches?"[Mo0:37]
Posts: 107
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Post by darthrosenberg9 on Nov 28, 2008 23:12:32 GMT -5
Actually, Brian confirmed that the axe in After The Fall is not the infamous Slayer's Scythe. Actually, it is the slayer's scythe depending how you view it. But in reality it just the Hagun Shaft. Don't confuse the readers! I'm sorry. I guess my post wasn't very clear. I've read the interview, and already knew that it wasn't actually the scythe. I just wondered what people thought about it. It was back with my "Melaka's scythe may not be the same scythe that Buffy carries" theory. It's unimportant now anyway. I never did make the connection with the Hagun Shaft, though. I'll have to look back. Sorry about the confusion.
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Patches
Innocent Bystander
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 19
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Post by Patches on Nov 29, 2008 6:28:51 GMT -5
Ok, time for my monthly (or in this case quarterly) comeback.javascript:add(' ') Got the issue. I wrote down some cliffnotes and thoughts about it. Hesitate to call this a review. More of a rant. Since it is rather long I will put it under spoiler. So, when we last saw her, our blonde hero was being backstabbed by our purple-haired hero. Opening scene of the issue 19 directly follows that.
Future Dark Willow has internal monologue. On red background. Evil! She is the 6th person with internal monologue on the comic, after Buffy, Xander, Giles, Faith and Mel. Andrew, Rona, Dawn, Kennedy, Lea, Satsu, Simone, Red Willow and Saga Vasuki are waiting for their turn.
Anyway all FDW’s internal ranting about history and living it could have been just as easily said aloud. Moving on…
Hey, it’s a Buffy bondage scene. Thick chains, very flimsy looking wooden chair. I get a season 7 flashback. Of cause chair probably has magical plot protection. Like the weapon cage in the library which was able to stop werewolves, vampires and all other super-strong demons.
“I have forgotten her excellent nose.”
I am with Will here. Although I wouldn’t say “excellent” but “adorable”. Buffy nose is adorable.
“Oh, my God! You went dark again? You are so in a huge trouble for going dark.”
Buffy wakes up. Her reaction on seeing Dark Willow is hilarious. Instead of the shock and horror which I expected, she talks like Willow just changed hair color to one which Buffy doesn’t like.
“Actually I have a few Q’s as well.”
Harth and his groupies party-crashed. And he is not happy. FDW told him that Buffy need to get back in time for the Frayverse coming into being, and she told Fray the opposite. Now she is lying to one of them, but none can take chance that she is lying to him. Nice gambit Willow. Except wouldn’t it be better to not tell Harth anything at all?
“Yes, well, I dark that way.”
Heh.
While FDW engaged in her sophisizing, Gates the Demon Monkey picked locks on Buffy’s chains.
BTW, Harth likes to talk big. He is a Big Bad. He has an army. He… well no matter. Truth to tell I never got what makes him a major threat in the original Fray comics, I don’t get it here either. I mean, he is just a vamp…
Gunther enters the scene packing some serious hardware. This is getting ridiculous. I like the fish but I wouldn’t mind him dead or, even better, turned either. Last scene with him was a good exit scene. This one is a joke. Next time when Harth manage to raise an army, why even call Fray. Joe the Plumber can take care of them with his Star Destroyer.
Next scene.
Buffy beats up her evil twin, zaps Mel and skedaddles.
Now we interrupt this broadcast for the direct footage from Narnia. All big-sized woodland creatures, medium-sized woodland creatures, small woodland creatures and Dawn unite to repel the green menace for all that is holy. Oh, there are also mushrooms in the midst.
“Let us show these abominations the Forest’s Rage!” Lorelahn bellows. Oh, boy…
Dawn the Centaur Girl is waving around huge claymore while Xander the Butt Monkey – small dagger and acorn helmet. By the way, it is really funny for me that Dawn follows Ariel the Mermaid school of modesty: only human naughty bits need to be covered.
Xan and Dawn exchange some more dirty jokes. Which is incidentally, her actual purpose in this story (yes, I mean Buffy S8). Hey, Joss, enough horsing around, lets make the final Dawn transformation what it should be: Catgirl, and lets make it stuck. Then we can get all these pussycat jokes rolling.
Anyway, back in the fight… slayers came and saved the day, concluding this utterly pointless arc. Seriously, unless the whole thing was a setup for some HCGOLLA, it was a total waste of space. The whole attack on the castle sequence would work way better, if following missile attack on the castle in issue 16 we would get 2 issues of suspense and in this issue Dawn would have dug Xander out of the rubble.
Ok, let’s go back to the real story.
Buffy and Mel confrontation. They exchange some words.
“Can you swear that my world won’t mist out if you leave? My best bonds? My sister?”
Mel is being a spoilsport: Giles in the “Wish” was more adventurous. From the other hand Melaka is very adjusted. She is much more in tune with her world then either Buffy or Faith ever was with theirs. This is why Mel is protecting her world while Buffy seeks to change hers. What makes this confrontation interesting is that they both right, and in the universe where result of the fight is determined not by physical prowess, but by strength of conviction this should be pretty even fight.
Slayers finally came to blows. As I expected it is more or less an even match. Melaka has been a slayer longer, but Buffy has slayer heritage. Buffy dumps the water tower on Mel. Seriously. The water tower. They’ve got a wooden water tower in the middle of frikking future metropolis! Not to mention that the wood is supposed to be very scarce in Frayverse.
“She is just a tiny, whiney, long-dead slayer in a damn unpractical frock!”
Hey! On behalf of Buffy, I resent that statement: I bet she patrolled plenty of times in that dress. And that boots. And she is not dead yet.
…Meanwhile in the headquarters of the Evil League of Evil…
I admit I laughed out loud when I saw that Warren is again wearing just his lab coat. No man would walk around in lab coat and no pants. Pants for us, men, are like foundation for confidence. And Warren is supposed to be Macho Geek. You know, Tough Strong Geek Who Takes No Nonsense from Wymen, who are all Whores anyway. And of cause everything is their fault, and in that particular instance it’s Amy’s. Apparently these green mist snakes were her doing.
I am inclined to agree with Warren here, it’s all Amy’s fault. The whole sequence with centaur ride, meeting with Lorelahn and Narnia, silly army of zombies, ridiculous Warren resurrection. All her fault! Well, what to expect from rabid psycho? And just to think that at the end of season 7 she wasn’t one…
Ok, enough of these musings… back to the story.
Twilight is doing his standard shtick: floating around and talking in distorted font. He is actually talking to a muscled man in military pants. This is our mysterious informant who is Twilight’s “man on the inside”. It is with him Buffy met in issue 16.
I try to mentally browse back the issues, to try to determine who this man look like. Xan? No, he is not wearing the Xander’s grey sweater. Could not be him. Giles? No. Ok, I give up, let’s turn the page.
Oh, my god! It’s Daniel Craig!
OK, okay, it’s probably Riley Finn. A bit difficult to figure out with this art.
Riley. Last seen S6, “As You Were”, happily married. The only one of Buffy love interest who managed to get away from her relatively unscathed, and dared not to spend eternity pining for our blonde slayer. The most hated and bashed-on character in Buffyverse (well after Dawn and Kennedy). Mr. Nice Guy. He must be Evil!
Lame.
I just don’t particularity see how he could be the betrayer considering that he appears in this story for the first time. And if it is Riley who is “the closest the most unexpected” then this is a one hell of a letdown.
Let’s get back to our slayers.
In preparation for their rescue attempt Kenny blindfolds Willow. Why? Because we need one more plot convenience. In one very nice shot Buffy breaks Mel’s Scythe. But before she can dive into the portal FDW stops her. She makes it clear that Buffy have to go though her to get back in time. Buffy does.
This scene could probably have a bigger impact on me if it would be any kind of a surprise. But it was obvious. FDW’s gambit from very beginning was “Buffy should kill her”. Dark Willow always was suicidal.
So our blonde hero concludes her Excellent Adventure. She is hugging Willow and crying and saying that she loves her.
“I am watching these hands, you two…” Kennedy the Possessive Girlfriend and I comment together.
So what happened to the Frayverse. Is it destroyed? Nope. Impact of the whole storyline on Frayverse is exactly zero. It remains in stasis. Nothing changed there. Harth will continue gather vamp armies. Gunther will continue being a lowly crime lord. Mel is OK. We haven’t even received a conclusive answer on whether Frayverse is a future of Buffyverse, because we haven’t received any confirmation on which fictional time travel rules this story operates. Besides it is not like we will get any more Fray these decade.
So, finita.
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Post by edge450 on Nov 29, 2008 7:28:56 GMT -5
Ok, time for my monthly (or in this case quarterly) comeback.javascript:add(' ') Got the issue. I wrote down some cliffnotes and thoughts about it. Hesitate to call this a review. More of a rant. Since it is rather long I will put it under spoiler. So, when we last saw her, our blonde hero was being backstabbed by our purple-haired hero. Opening scene of the issue 19 directly follows that.
Future Dark Willow has internal monologue. On red background. Evil! She is the 6th person with internal monologue on the comic, after Buffy, Xander, Giles, Faith and Mel. Andrew, Rona, Dawn, Kennedy, Lea, Satsu, Simone, Red Willow and Saga Vasuki are waiting for their turn.
Anyway all FDW’s internal ranting about history and living it could have been just as easily said aloud. Moving on…
Hey, it’s a Buffy bondage scene. Thick chains, very flimsy looking wooden chair. I get a season 7 flashback. Of cause chair probably has magical plot protection. Like the weapon cage in the library which was able to stop werewolves, vampires and all other super-strong demons.
“I have forgotten her excellent nose.”
I am with Will here. Although I wouldn’t say “excellent” but “adorable”. Buffy nose is adorable.
“Oh, my God! You went dark again? You are so in a huge trouble for going dark.”
Buffy wakes up. Her reaction on seeing Dark Willow is hilarious. Instead of the shock and horror which I expected, she talks like Willow just changed hair color to one which Buffy doesn’t like.
“Actually I have a few Q’s as well.”
Harth and his groupies party-crashed. And he is not happy. FDW told him that Buffy need to get back in time for the Frayverse coming into being, and she told Fray the opposite. Now she is lying to one of them, but none can take chance that she is lying to him. Nice gambit Willow. Except wouldn’t it be better to not tell Harth anything at all?
“Yes, well, I dark that way.”
Heh.
While FDW engaged in her sophisizing, Gates the Demon Monkey picked locks on Buffy’s chains.
BTW, Harth likes to talk big. He is a Big Bad. He has an army. He… well no matter. Truth to tell I never got what makes him a major threat in the original Fray comics, I don’t get it here either. I mean, he is just a vamp…
Gunther enters the scene packing some serious hardware. This is getting ridiculous. I like the fish but I wouldn’t mind him dead or, even better, turned either. Last scene with him was a good exit scene. This one is a joke. Next time when Harth manage to raise an army, why even call Fray. Joe the Plumber can take care of them with his Star Destroyer.
Next scene.
Buffy beats up her evil twin, zaps Mel and skedaddles.
Now we interrupt this broadcast for the direct footage from Narnia. All big-sized woodland creatures, medium-sized woodland creatures, small woodland creatures and Dawn unite to repel the green menace for all that is holy. Oh, there are also mushrooms in the midst.
“Let us show these abominations the Forest’s Rage!” Lorelahn bellows. Oh, boy…
Dawn the Centaur Girl is waving around huge claymore while Xander the Butt Monkey – small dagger and acorn helmet. By the way, it is really funny for me that Dawn follows Ariel the Mermaid school of modesty: only human naughty bits need to be covered.
Xan and Dawn exchange some more dirty jokes. Which is incidentally, her actual purpose in this story (yes, I mean Buffy S8). Hey, Joss, enough horsing around, lets make the final Dawn transformation what it should be: Catgirl, and lets make it stuck. Then we can get all these pussycat jokes rolling.
Anyway, back in the fight… slayers came and saved the day, concluding this utterly pointless arc. Seriously, unless the whole thing was a setup for some HCGOLLA, it was a total waste of space. The whole attack on the castle sequence would work way better, if following missile attack on the castle in issue 16 we would get 2 issues of suspense and in this issue Dawn would have dug Xander out of the rubble.
Ok, let’s go back to the real story.
Buffy and Mel confrontation. They exchange some words.
“Can you swear that my world won’t mist out if you leave? My best bonds? My sister?”
Mel is being a spoilsport: Giles in the “Wish” was more adventurous. From the other hand Melaka is very adjusted. She is much more in tune with her world then either Buffy or Faith ever was with theirs. This is why Mel is protecting her world while Buffy seeks to change hers. What makes this confrontation interesting is that they both right, and in the universe where result of the fight is determined not by physical prowess, but by strength of conviction this should be pretty even fight.
Slayers finally came to blows. As I expected it is more or less an even match. Melaka has been a slayer longer, but Buffy has slayer heritage. Buffy dumps the water tower on Mel. Seriously. The water tower. They’ve got a wooden water tower in the middle of frikking future metropolis! Not to mention that the wood is supposed to be very scarce in Frayverse.
“She is just a tiny, whiney, long-dead slayer in a damn unpractical frock!”
Hey! On behalf of Buffy, I resent that statement: I bet she patrolled plenty of times in that dress. And that boots. And she is not dead yet.
…Meanwhile in the headquarters of the Evil League of Evil…
I admit I laughed out loud when I saw that Warren is again wearing just his lab coat. No man would walk around in lab coat and no pants. Pants for us, men, are like foundation for confidence. And Warren is supposed to be Macho Geek. You know, Tough Strong Geek Who Takes No Nonsense from Wymen, who are all Whores anyway. And of cause everything is their fault, and in that particular instance it’s Amy’s. Apparently these green mist snakes were her doing.
I am inclined to agree with Warren here, it’s all Amy’s fault. The whole sequence with centaur ride, meeting with Lorelahn and Narnia, silly army of zombies, ridiculous Warren resurrection. All her fault! Well, what to expect from rabid psycho? And just to think that at the end of season 7 she wasn’t one…
Ok, enough of these musings… back to the story.
Twilight is doing his standard shtick: floating around and talking in distorted font. He is actually talking to a muscled man in military pants. This is our mysterious informant who is Twilight’s “man on the inside”. It is with him Buffy met in issue 16.
I try to mentally browse back the issues, to try to determine who this man look like. Xan? No, he is not wearing the Xander’s grey sweater. Could not be him. Giles? No. Ok, I give up, let’s turn the page.
Oh, my god! It’s Daniel Craig!
OK, okay, it’s probably Riley Finn. A bit difficult to figure out with this art.
Riley. Last seen S6, “As You Were”, happily married. The only one of Buffy love interest who managed to get away from her relatively unscathed, and dared not to spend eternity pining for our blonde slayer. The most hated and bashed-on character in Buffyverse (well after Dawn and Kennedy). Mr. Nice Guy. He must be Evil!
Lame.
I just don’t particularity see how he could be the betrayer considering that he appears in this story for the first time. And if it is Riley who is “the closest the most unexpected” then this is a one hell of a letdown.
Let’s get back to our slayers.
In preparation for their rescue attempt Kenny blindfolds Willow. Why? Because we need one more plot convenience. In one very nice shot Buffy breaks Mel’s Scythe. But before she can dive into the portal FDW stops her. She makes it clear that Buffy have to go though her to get back in time. Buffy does.
This scene could probably have a bigger impact on me if it would be any kind of a surprise. But it was obvious. FDW’s gambit from very beginning was “Buffy should kill her”. Dark Willow always was suicidal.
So our blonde hero concludes her Excellent Adventure. She is hugging Willow and crying and saying that she loves her.
“I am watching these hands, you two…” Kennedy the Possessive Girlfriend and I comment together.
So what happened to the Frayverse. Is it destroyed? Nope. Impact of the whole storyline on Frayverse is exactly zero. It remains in stasis. Nothing changed there. Harth will continue gather vamp armies. Gunther will continue being a lowly crime lord. Mel is OK. We haven’t even received a conclusive answer on whether Frayverse is a future of Buffyverse, because we haven’t received any confirmation on which fictional time travel rules this story operates. Besides it is not like we will get any more Fray these decade.
So, finita.
And a good rant it was.
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Patches
Innocent Bystander
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 19
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Post by Patches on Nov 29, 2008 7:32:29 GMT -5
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Post by henzINNIT on Nov 29, 2008 18:57:08 GMT -5
Riley's bad now eh? Board members made some truely impressive arguments as to his potential to become a villain which makes me totally okay with this shift, BUT it's a forced villain to add to the list of forced villains unfortunately. Riley's tale may prove really interesting, although I'm thinking that it will make the return of Amy and Warren even harder to swallow for me. I might travel and buy the 19 issues soon. Not sure it'll convert me, but I don't like being out of the loop lol
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dane5by5
Wise-cracking Techno Genius
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 734
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Post by dane5by5 on Nov 29, 2008 22:39:40 GMT -5
Ok, time for my monthly (or in this case quarterly) comeback.javascript:add(' ') Got the issue. I wrote down some cliffnotes and thoughts about it. Hesitate to call this a review. More of a rant. Since it is rather long I will put it under spoiler. So, when we last saw her, our blonde hero was being backstabbed by our purple-haired hero. Opening scene of the issue 19 directly follows that.
Future Dark Willow has internal monologue. On red background. Evil! She is the 6th person with internal monologue on the comic, after Buffy, Xander, Giles, Faith and Mel. Andrew, Rona, Dawn, Kennedy, Lea, Satsu, Simone, Red Willow and Saga Vasuki are waiting for their turn.
Anyway all FDW’s internal ranting about history and living it could have been just as easily said aloud. Moving on…
Hey, it’s a Buffy bondage scene. Thick chains, very flimsy looking wooden chair. I get a season 7 flashback. Of cause chair probably has magical plot protection. Like the weapon cage in the library which was able to stop werewolves, vampires and all other super-strong demons.
“I have forgotten her excellent nose.”
I am with Will here. Although I wouldn’t say “excellent” but “adorable”. Buffy nose is adorable.
“Oh, my God! You went dark again? You are so in a huge trouble for going dark.”
Buffy wakes up. Her reaction on seeing Dark Willow is hilarious. Instead of the shock and horror which I expected, she talks like Willow just changed hair color to one which Buffy doesn’t like.
“Actually I have a few Q’s as well.”
Harth and his groupies party-crashed. And he is not happy. FDW told him that Buffy need to get back in time for the Frayverse coming into being, and she told Fray the opposite. Now she is lying to one of them, but none can take chance that she is lying to him. Nice gambit Willow. Except wouldn’t it be better to not tell Harth anything at all?
“Yes, well, I dark that way.”
Heh.
While FDW engaged in her sophisizing, Gates the Demon Monkey picked locks on Buffy’s chains.
BTW, Harth likes to talk big. He is a Big Bad. He has an army. He… well no matter. Truth to tell I never got what makes him a major threat in the original Fray comics, I don’t get it here either. I mean, he is just a vamp…
Gunther enters the scene packing some serious hardware. This is getting ridiculous. I like the fish but I wouldn’t mind him dead or, even better, turned either. Last scene with him was a good exit scene. This one is a joke. Next time when Harth manage to raise an army, why even call Fray. Joe the Plumber can take care of them with his Star Destroyer.
Next scene.
Buffy beats up her evil twin, zaps Mel and skedaddles.
Now we interrupt this broadcast for the direct footage from Narnia. All big-sized woodland creatures, medium-sized woodland creatures, small woodland creatures and Dawn unite to repel the green menace for all that is holy. Oh, there are also mushrooms in the midst.
“Let us show these abominations the Forest’s Rage!” Lorelahn bellows. Oh, boy…
Dawn the Centaur Girl is waving around huge claymore while Xander the Butt Monkey – small dagger and acorn helmet. By the way, it is really funny for me that Dawn follows Ariel the Mermaid school of modesty: only human naughty bits need to be covered.
Xan and Dawn exchange some more dirty jokes. Which is incidentally, her actual purpose in this story (yes, I mean Buffy S8). Hey, Joss, enough horsing around, lets make the final Dawn transformation what it should be: Catgirl, and lets make it stuck. Then we can get all these pussycat jokes rolling.
Anyway, back in the fight… slayers came and saved the day, concluding this utterly pointless arc. Seriously, unless the whole thing was a setup for some HCGOLLA, it was a total waste of space. The whole attack on the castle sequence would work way better, if following missile attack on the castle in issue 16 we would get 2 issues of suspense and in this issue Dawn would have dug Xander out of the rubble.
Ok, let’s go back to the real story.
Buffy and Mel confrontation. They exchange some words.
“Can you swear that my world won’t mist out if you leave? My best bonds? My sister?”
Mel is being a spoilsport: Giles in the “Wish” was more adventurous. From the other hand Melaka is very adjusted. She is much more in tune with her world then either Buffy or Faith ever was with theirs. This is why Mel is protecting her world while Buffy seeks to change hers. What makes this confrontation interesting is that they both right, and in the universe where result of the fight is determined not by physical prowess, but by strength of conviction this should be pretty even fight.
Slayers finally came to blows. As I expected it is more or less an even match. Melaka has been a slayer longer, but Buffy has slayer heritage. Buffy dumps the water tower on Mel. Seriously. The water tower. They’ve got a wooden water tower in the middle of frikking future metropolis! Not to mention that the wood is supposed to be very scarce in Frayverse.
“She is just a tiny, whiney, long-dead slayer in a damn unpractical frock!”
Hey! On behalf of Buffy, I resent that statement: I bet she patrolled plenty of times in that dress. And that boots. And she is not dead yet.
…Meanwhile in the headquarters of the Evil League of Evil…
I admit I laughed out loud when I saw that Warren is again wearing just his lab coat. No man would walk around in lab coat and no pants. Pants for us, men, are like foundation for confidence. And Warren is supposed to be Macho Geek. You know, Tough Strong Geek Who Takes No Nonsense from Wymen, who are all Whores anyway. And of cause everything is their fault, and in that particular instance it’s Amy’s. Apparently these green mist snakes were her doing.
I am inclined to agree with Warren here, it’s all Amy’s fault. The whole sequence with centaur ride, meeting with Lorelahn and Narnia, silly army of zombies, ridiculous Warren resurrection. All her fault! Well, what to expect from rabid psycho? And just to think that at the end of season 7 she wasn’t one…
Ok, enough of these musings… back to the story.
Twilight is doing his standard shtick: floating around and talking in distorted font. He is actually talking to a muscled man in military pants. This is our mysterious informant who is Twilight’s “man on the inside”. It is with him Buffy met in issue 16.
I try to mentally browse back the issues, to try to determine who this man look like. Xan? No, he is not wearing the Xander’s grey sweater. Could not be him. Giles? No. Ok, I give up, let’s turn the page.
Oh, my god! It’s Daniel Craig!
OK, okay, it’s probably Riley Finn. A bit difficult to figure out with this art.
Riley. Last seen S6, “As You Were”, happily married. The only one of Buffy love interest who managed to get away from her relatively unscathed, and dared not to spend eternity pining for our blonde slayer. The most hated and bashed-on character in Buffyverse (well after Dawn and Kennedy). Mr. Nice Guy. He must be Evil!
Lame.
I just don’t particularity see how he could be the betrayer considering that he appears in this story for the first time. And if it is Riley who is “the closest the most unexpected” then this is a one hell of a letdown.
Let’s get back to our slayers.
In preparation for their rescue attempt Kenny blindfolds Willow. Why? Because we need one more plot convenience. In one very nice shot Buffy breaks Mel’s Scythe. But before she can dive into the portal FDW stops her. She makes it clear that Buffy have to go though her to get back in time. Buffy does.
This scene could probably have a bigger impact on me if it would be any kind of a surprise. But it was obvious. FDW’s gambit from very beginning was “Buffy should kill her”. Dark Willow always was suicidal.
So our blonde hero concludes her Excellent Adventure. She is hugging Willow and crying and saying that she loves her.
“I am watching these hands, you two…” Kennedy the Possessive Girlfriend and I comment together.
So what happened to the Frayverse. Is it destroyed? Nope. Impact of the whole storyline on Frayverse is exactly zero. It remains in stasis. Nothing changed there. Harth will continue gather vamp armies. Gunther will continue being a lowly crime lord. Mel is OK. We haven’t even received a conclusive answer on whether Frayverse is a future of Buffyverse, because we haven’t received any confirmation on which fictional time travel rules this story operates. Besides it is not like we will get any more Fray these decade.
So, finita.
You made some valid points, but I can't tell, did you like this issue and arc, or not? I'll make some reply points to your rant: FDW's internal dialogue I feel when a writer is trying to convey a characters thoughts, sometimes it's better to err on the side of caution and make it an internal thought, like a stream of consciousness, rather than writing a situation that allows them to share their thoughts, which sometimes comes across as contrived and inauthentic. In this situation however, I think either would have worked well, just because of the subject matter and the running theme of the story. Library Cage/Wooden Chair I love that convinient library cage! All those things that were trapped inside and didn't manage to escape! Makes me nostalgic just thinking about it. Harth Regarding Harth's significance as a Big Bad, read the posts Emmie and myself made before yours. Gunther There's never been precedent in the Buffyverse of a demon being made vampire, that I'm aware of and Gunther is too fun to die! I think this scene worked, as it created the distraction needed, while developing Gunther as a threat, rather than just a fish in a bowl. Forrest Friends I have to concur with you regarding this storyline, it did seem gratuitous, especially Dawn's role of comic relief. I had no problem with Dawn taking on Ariel's dress code of only covering human naughty bits. It's very hard to find Horse pants these days. The part where the Slayers/Wiccans rallied to save the day was a nice touch. For me anyway. Buffy Vs. Fray I love your comparison of Fray's position to Giles in "The Wish". I never noticed the similarities when reading this story. But they are right there and Fray makes some very powerful points. I always thought Buffy had been Slayer for far longer than Fray at this point. The edge that Fray had was this being her world. Her having a feel for the environment and her surroundings, while Buffy had the edge of all the previous battles she's fought/experienced in dreams. You make a great point about Buffy's outfit, she's fought in variations of this outfit for years, it's like her battle armour. I thought the fight itself was very well done, even Buffy splitting open the water tower, hey they couldn't have done this on the television series! It looked visually impressive. Twilight and Co. Don't have much to say about this, other than, in Season Seven, Amy was kind of psychopathic. I mean, to borrow a phrase, she wasn't going to be on the cover of Sanity Fair anytime soon. I see this just as a continuation and completely supported by the text of Season Six and Seven of BtVS. I don't know how anyone couldn't recognise Riley in this scene, it was so obvious to me! The likeness was there, and the characterisations in terms of clothing and the adorable little face! I think this makes for an interesting betrayal as he is Twilight's mole, it is surprising and Buffy will be very upset when she finds out. It will be very unexpected for her as a character. Even closer if she is trying to start somthing again with him romantically. Not a letdown at all for me. FDW Vs. Buffy Vs. Fray I've already posted how much I liked Buffy breaking Fray's Scythe and the symbolism that expressed. Buffy killing FDW would have had more of an impact for me, if the art was better. It could have been such an iconic moment in the series, but the lackluster art reduced it to mediocre for me. Both Worlds Remain I didn't expect Fray's world to "mist out" or anyone in her world to die, this is Buffy's story afterall! If anything big goes down in Haddyn, it needs to be told in Fray's story. I liked the moment between Willow and Buffy on the rooftop, it was touching and I can't wait for Willow to find out her future, it seems inevitable that she will. So the status quo remains in both worlds, only Fray is down one Scythe and Buffy is up one piece of info.
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angelmonster
Potential Slayer
Tuesday's Son[Mo0:6]
Posts: 107
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Post by angelmonster on Nov 29, 2008 23:34:07 GMT -5
I am offically making my prediction now about Riley. 1) He is a double agent, working for Twilight but secretly helping Buffy. 2) His wife(who is a great person yet I hate more then any other character int he Buffy verse, even more thne Dawn)was killed by evil Slayers and it sent him to the Dark side.
The biggest disappointment about this arc is the lack of plot moveage. It really didn't go anywhere yet had so much potential! Plus it is looking more and more like Xander could be Twilight(we see a future Dark Willow why not a Dark Xander from the future?). I just see, SOMEW HOW, at the end of this that like with every other season of Buffy that Buffy will be the blame for all of this when it is her friends(Willow and Riley)doing the dirty work.
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cyclo
Common Vampire
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 79
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Post by cyclo on Nov 30, 2008 0:24:23 GMT -5
I think the reason why DFX is less likely is that, well, Xander is Xander. No powers, his whole thing is bein' the normal one! I'm not saying it isn't possible or anything, it's just something that would need mucho explanation!
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Iceeh★
Bad Ass Wicca
Also, Angels.
Somewhere, along in the bitterness.[Mo0:7]
Posts: 2,298
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Post by Iceeh★ on Nov 30, 2008 0:49:04 GMT -5
OMG RILEY!!! Well, that threw me for a spin, I was convinced he was Twilight! And I had to read the comic twice before I realized it was him. xD Anyways, the issue was fantastic. It was pretty obvious that FDW was gonna die, and I loved the panel with Willow reaching through the portal for Buffy, Buffy reaching towards Willow, Fray reaching towards Buffy, and FDW falling to the ground. Pretty neat stuff. I'm gonna miss Karl's art though, I really liked his drawing style.
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witcher
Wise-cracking Techno Genius
Homicidal Bunny
Willow fan forever[Mo0:30]
Posts: 711
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Post by witcher on Nov 30, 2008 6:14:03 GMT -5
One thing about TOYL that I still can't wait to find out about: what was the spoiler alert??? Could it be that Buffy found out that Riley was betraying her??? And is Riley the betrayer mentioned in ABH?? It would work for me, I never liked him so him going evil is fine with me. It would be perfect if he died trying to save Buffy, redeeming himself
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Patches
Innocent Bystander
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 19
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Post by Patches on Nov 30, 2008 6:42:38 GMT -5
You made some valid points, but I can't tell, did you like this issue and arc, or not? It's 50/50 for both. Would have been way higher because I really liked the previous issue, but couple of things really brought it down. You see, over the years of watching "Buffy" I learned not to dwell too much on the little mistakes and inconsistencies. With the TV show it is almost a requirement to enjoy it. Things like the library cage and slow moving vampires and Xander getting smacked on the head with huge metal hammer (Spike couldn't lift that thing) and getting up in the next moment. These are all OK. I chuckle and move on. Like with the chair; I was just pointing out the funny... I don't even have problem with such things like nigh indestructible/killed by sneezing Ubervamps, or the hilariously forgotten sea. Although S7 have other problems. What really brings this whole arc down for me are 3 things: the Evil Riley, Xander and Dawn's psychedelic adventures and the Evil Riley. Seriously, Evil Riley is strike 2 against the whole comic. Strike 1 being the whole dead/not-dead Warren deal. Thankfully Evil Riley is actually fixable, he just have to actually work for Buffy. Then again, I actually consider Buffy the villain of the story... Dilemma... Well at least that will change the label on Riley from 'Evil' to 'Misguided'. Since this post is getting kinda long I will answer your other points next time.
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