El Diablo Robotico
Ensouled Vampire
Robo Pimp-Daddy
"Surely you have heard about our great victory over the Devil's Robot."[Mo0:3]
Posts: 1,199
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Post by El Diablo Robotico on May 9, 2008 18:04:26 GMT -5
I just feel bad that Brian felt the need to have to respond to that. We're very lucky that he comes here often, reads our comments, and even occasionally replies to some of the things we say... so is it too much to ask to treat him and his work with respect? If there's something in the comics you don't like, try to find a way to criticize it constructively. And if you can't, at least try to criticize it politely. We're a passionate fanbase, but come on--have some class. Hopefully Brian realizes that that post was part of a very small minority, that most of us love what he's doing, and we really appreciate having him hanging around the forums...
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Post by Skytteflickan88 on May 9, 2008 18:13:28 GMT -5
Well you know, let's cut whedon fan a break(mix of methapors?). some times I need to bitch too.
true, I wouldn't bitch about brian Lynch's work in such a uncontructive manner where he could read it, but I'm not that nice when I'm dispointed either.
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Post by buffyfan21 on May 9, 2008 18:14:51 GMT -5
I thought it was great seeing Kate again. I often wondered what happened to her after Angel saved her life. I especially liked the part where she tells Connor what Angel once said to her. That just happens to be one of my fave quotes, so I was really happy to see it there. What Angel said obviously made a lasting impression on Kate. On another note... Is Fred evil? It's not really her is it? That's what i got from it at least, unless I was interpreting it wrong....At first I thought it was Illyria playing dress up as Fred again, but now I think that that "thing" is something else entirely....Obviously something very evil and menacing.....Thoughts? Also, I saw at the end of the issue that Angel will be released bi-weekly next month, how come? I think it's totally awesome, I was just wondering. Heck, I wish they would stick to bi-weekly permanently! I dunno about you all, but once a month seems like an ETERNITY to wait for a comic! Anywho...superb issue as always!
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Enisy
Descendant of a Toaster Oven
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 643
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Post by Enisy on May 9, 2008 18:17:06 GMT -5
No, it's not Fred (nor Eve, from what Brian says). I'm not sure who it is... The speech pattern reminds me a lot of Lilah ("So smart. The brain on this one!"), as do the mannerisms, and she does seem to have a good grasp of Wesley ("See, I knew you'd be smarter than this. They thought you'd be so desperate to believe that we'd have to just drop the curtain and tell you when it would hurt the most." ... "We have him, but he's a noble sort, he'll do the right thing, eyes on the prize or not")... but... I can't imagine she'd relish hurting Wesley like Fake!Fred did here. Which is not to say I wouldn't love to see Lilah back.
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Smashed
Junior Vampire Slayer
[Mo0:3]
Posts: 908
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Post by Smashed on May 9, 2008 18:46:50 GMT -5
Oh God, that rant was kind of embarresing to us Slayalivers. It's common sense to stop reading a comic you dont like. There's no sense in going into a thread and bitching about how much is wrong with it and how crappy it is. You came off as a real bunghole there, great job.
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Post by buffyfan21 on May 9, 2008 18:59:00 GMT -5
No, it's not Fred (nor Eve, from what Brian says). I'm not sure who it is... The speech pattern reminds me a lot of Lilah ("So smart. The brain on this one!"), as do the mannerisms, and she does seem to have a good grasp of Wesley ("See, I knew you'd be smarter than this. They thought you'd be so desperate to believe that we'd have to just drop the curtain and tell you when it would hurt the most." ... "We have him, but he's a noble sort, he'll do the right thing, eyes on the prize or not")... but... I can't imagine she'd relish hurting Wesley like Fake!Fred did here. Which is not to say I wouldn't love to see Lilah back. The thought of it being Lilah hadn't occured to me but now that you mention it, that sure does sound a lot like her. Good point! Although, it is kinda ironic considering how much Lilah has always DESPISED Fred. But leave it to Joss to throw in ironic twists like that. That's why we love him right?
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Post by sagewoman on May 9, 2008 19:02:52 GMT -5
Brian - I LOVE your writing. I LOVE this comic. Angel and Buffy are the first comics I have ever bought and they are great! (BTW - it was around 1960-65 when I last bought/read comics).
Don't let the naysayers get you down. Some people are just negative and like to rant. They also tend to write the longest posts too. I hope that the sales and number of positive posts make up for the critical ones. Keep on doing what you are doing. I'm glad it's Kate. I love Betta George. And, am waiting to learn the dragon's name.
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Joe
Wise-cracking Sidekick
Obsessive Paranoid Boob
"Gypsies are filthy people! We shall speak of zem no more!" *spits* -Ilona Costa Bianchi[Mo0:0]
Posts: 2,786
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Post by Joe on May 10, 2008 12:28:25 GMT -5
Ok so I read it, and I have a few things to say. I love the Wesley story, especially because it proves that he's not evil. And it's really Wesley. ;D Then theres the Kate/Connor Story. Once I found out that Kate was the mystery woman and not Darla or Cordy, it was a letdown for me like I said before. :-[But once I read it, I found out that Kate fits perfectly in this story. And I regret saying what I said before. I think it's cool that it was Kate that helped Connor out using Angels Advice. SWEET.
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Post by fire2flame on May 10, 2008 13:32:15 GMT -5
Um, not to be a shameless plugger, but, after seeing all the pies fly across the room, it doesn't seem so lame: If, for some ungodly reason you have doubts about Lynch's work, you should check out Everybody's Dead, you will laugh your ass off. I laughed out loud on many occasions while reading it, which is a rarity for me and usually only happens with the likes of Woody Allen or David Sedaris. Seriously, you'll wonder why this guy's not on stage somewhere. And, as Joss said (got to bring him in the discussion), if you can do comedy, you can do anything. Comic timing is far more complex than, say, the dramatic pause or the climax of a tragedy. Anyway, nuf said. Love ATF, and anxiously await each release date.
Moving on: so, not Eve, huh? I would have sworn I hit the bull's eye on that one. Lilah's a good guess, too. Saw her name floating around somewhere on page 3; but, it might not even be someone we know; and I think there's also a strong possibility that we wont ever know. As of right now, her only real purpose was to try and hurt Wesley somehow, but the only person really capable of doing that is Fred. Seeing her alive probably made his heart ache more than anything W&H could have done. He was also really the only person who didn't give a damn about dying in 'Not Fade Away', and I think some part of him took solace in dying, because he thought Fred was dead, too. Wesley's pain will always be centered around Fred- he cares for his friends, but it was only her innocence and girl-like demeanor that could so dutifully pull him out of a funk; thus, seeing her alive is the real dagger in the back, because now his death will forever separate them from a 'corporeal embrace'. I think it's only truly now that Wesley could become an enemy to Angel and company. Before he didn't have anything to lose, now he does.
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Post by Brian Lynch on May 11, 2008 3:12:44 GMT -5
I don't think Lilah would want to intentionally hurt Wes like that.
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Post by henzINNIT on May 11, 2008 3:39:24 GMT -5
So uh... (senses awkward tension in the room) Does um, yeah, um... about that Donnie Darko 2. I bet that's gonna suck! Oh christ yes. Was there ever a worse sequel idea? Can people stop using Lynch as a fecking scapegoat please? I hear his name brought up loads but I don't ever recall anyone actually criticising his ability to write these characters. It's all "I don't like this plot. Give me Joss boo hoo" like you're forgeting Joss is as much responsible for this plot as Lynch is. I'm not gonna brown nose either though. Still waiting for a TPB so I can actually comment on the quality of this comic, lol
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pablo
Potential Slayer
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 101
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Post by pablo on May 11, 2008 5:13:33 GMT -5
I actually love this comic. Basically because it's Angel, it has the same feeling, the same mood the tv series has. Lately i've been watching season 5 all over again (best ATS season along with season 2), and it tastes just like the comic (not that i've actually eaten it lol) - the doubts, strained relationships, the loss of reasons to fight. it's perfect, and yes, lots of characters are coming back and this could easily be mistaken for a fan-pleasing politics, but i think it's just a way to round off most of the ATS characters who didnt get a proper closure. AND they're not bringing back the most beloved (Cordy anyone?) but the most interesting or useful storyline-wise. who would have bet on Kate and Groo's return instead of Darla, Doyle and Cordy's? Furthermore, i find ATF more focused than BTVS s.8, which seems to be lost in a gigantic, 40-issue plot. it is more satisfying yet challenging to read.
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Rachster
Bad Ass Wicca
♥Koala Girl♥
Rachster previousily know as buffyfanforever. :][Mo0:34]
Posts: 2,344
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Post by Rachster on May 11, 2008 9:37:56 GMT -5
I actually love this comic. Basically because it's Angel, it has the same feeling, the same mood the tv series has. Lately i've been watching season 5 all over again (best ATS season along with season 2), and it tastes just like the comic (not that i've actually eaten it lol) - the doubts, strained relationships, the loss of reasons to fight. it's perfect, and yes, lots of characters are coming back and this could easily be mistaken for a fan-pleasing politics, but i think it's just a way to round off most of the ATS characters who didnt get a proper closure. AND they're not bringing back the most beloved (Cordy anyone?) but the most interesting or useful storyline-wise. who would have bet on Kate and Groo's return instead of Darla, Doyle and Cordy's? Furthermore, i find ATF more focused than BTVS s.8, which seems to be lost in a gigantic, 40-issue plot. it is more satisfying yet challenging to read. I agree with everything you just said when i read angel it has the same feeling as if i was watching it on TV the characters the things that are happening. But when i read Buffy i really have to think about it and really imagine all the new characters and new places.. Buffy and satsu i love season 8 but i find it alot easier to get into after the fall the shock of Kate turning up (even though i was really hoping for Darla) i always felt Kate left without a real goodbye and also the shock of gunn thinking about slayers?
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deathquaker
Innocent Bystander
Proud geek girl[Mo0:37]
Posts: 33
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Post by deathquaker on May 11, 2008 15:26:06 GMT -5
Really enjoyed the writing of the issue--Wesley's story was very well done, and just what I'd expect of W&H to do to him. FakeFred was well done... I did have to wonder with the "Eve" symbology if she WAS Eve but I see that's been debunked. Didn't seem like her style anyway.
But we already see that Wolfram and Hart underestimate him--or did they truly expect him to see through the fakeness and was FakeFred just saying that 'They thought you'd fall for this' to make him overconfident? So hard to say. Wesley is manipulable towards darkness, certainly... but he is also deeper than he appears, and we can hope the Senior Partners' estimation of what he can do continues to be wrong. Of course, the hopes will likely be dashed, but that's the Whedonverse for ya.
And OMG, I was SO happy to see Kate. I was in the middle of watching old Season 1 eps with her in them when I opened up the issue and startled my friend who was watching with me with a "She's back! Kate's back!" My friend who was only seeing the eps for the first time said, "You mean she leaves?" Ooops. Despite spoiling my friend, it was a great discovery. Even if we all we see of her for awhile, it's good to know she's alive and kicking butt.
And I love that she takes care of Connor and sets him straight. Perfect person to do so, really--she's straightforward, but still empathetic enough to get the point across in the right way.
My biggest disappointment was the art. I think in both cases the artists almost tried too hard to get picture-perfect likenesses--some of the scenes looked like sketched screenshots, but that made the more impromptu poses look all the worst. Fred actually looks like Drusilla in one panel (the second panel on the first page, IIRC)--and from panel to panel goes from looking exactly like Amy Acker to nothing like. I'd prefer someone who doesn't do a PERFECT likeness to a CONSISTENT image panel to panel--very important in something like this.
And the inking was awful in both stories--in both cases I think too heavy handed, and therefore hardening lines on a faces that should be softened in the "light" I imagine most of those scenes should be in. It looks like the artists both inked their own work and I have to wonder if they usually have someone else ink their pencils, 'cause it seemed like a bad job.
Also: I got this advice from a comic artist: don't draw the character's teeth individually. It's always going to look funky. And in both Wes's smile and Fred's smile in that story, we see that's definitely the case.
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Post by richieshag89 on May 11, 2008 20:11:55 GMT -5
I'm sorry you thought it was Cordy. dont be, its much better that it wasnt her, i definetly liked that you chose someone so unexpected, and that it was someone that doesnt know that angel and connor are connected So uh... (senses awkward tension in the room) Does um, yeah, um... about that Donnie Darko 2. I bet that's gonna suck! Oh christ yes. Was there ever a worse sequel idea? ok i know this really has nothing to do with buffy but wow... some things need to stay deadddddddd, which is why cordelia coming back would not have been the right choice
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Post by SlayerLV on May 12, 2008 0:03:36 GMT -5
I thought it was an OK issue, I thought Wesley's story was the best and it was great seeing "Fred" back again. It was good to see Kate again but I was kinda wishing for a bigger character. Gunn keeping slayers in his basement hmm I wonder if Buffy knows that they are MIA. Also did anyone else think this issue seemed shorter than all the others?
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patxshand
Ensouled Vampire
Writer/director/Amy Acker's husband.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,918
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Post by patxshand on May 12, 2008 0:37:49 GMT -5
It was shorter. There is 20 pages instead of 22. Same with #6. That's why the poster thing is in there, to make up for the two pages.
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Post by Brian Lynch on May 12, 2008 12:49:21 GMT -5
That's because the stories were all sorts of lengths and we couldn't fit them all exactly at 22 pages per issue. When FIRST NIGHT was first hatched, it was a giant one-shot book, and then we were asked to make it in the actual ATF series. But I love the idea of posters in the center.
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El Diablo Robotico
Ensouled Vampire
Robo Pimp-Daddy
"Surely you have heard about our great victory over the Devil's Robot."[Mo0:3]
Posts: 1,199
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Post by El Diablo Robotico on May 12, 2008 13:42:54 GMT -5
Gunn keeping slayers in his basement hmm I wonder if Buffy knows that they are MIA. I wish we could get confirmation from Brian on whether that actually was Gunn's basement or not, because, since they're not being restrained in any obvious way, my impression was that it was just the basement of some random building. Maybe that'd be too spoiler-y, tho, and something we just need to wait and find out for ourselves... (I try to be patient, but it takes too long.)
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richie
Potential Slayer
[Mo0:1]
Posts: 170
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Post by richie on May 13, 2008 20:31:36 GMT -5
I love Buffy and Angel. Buffy Season 8 is doing good... and I'm liking Angel too... butttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttt I don't like the art of Angel... I spent 30 minutes trying to figure out who the heck the chick was talking to Wesley...(I think its Lilah, BTW). The mid panel of Fred's face- its just like Amy. But the third one.... urgh hard to know... I think they could have a better art man...
The plot is so confusing... but if you read it like 20 times in a row, you'll eventually understand..
It was really good to see Kate back... I always felt that her dissapearing was a giant hole in the series...
And the last thing I have to say is.... Cordy was never meant to die... she just died because Charisma wanted to go out, and spend more time with her baby... so I think it's more than normal to bring her back.... The reason I think they won't bring her back is because her character grew too much... She's like goku super sayan 4.... But I think if they make a Season 7 she must be back... with her visions too.... I would love to see the whole gang unite again(including Spike)...
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