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Post by AndrewCrossett on Mar 8, 2010 8:33:46 GMT -5
Where did you read that? Since it's impossible to tell at the moment. There were a bunch of Slayers killed around the world, but they were nameless (and for the most part, faceless). So either someone's trying to stir crap up, or they're making crap up, and either way, it's crappy of them. Well, at one point there was concern that all the Slayers had been slaughtered, apart from the ones in Tibet with Buffy. I know I thought so for a little while. I think it came from thinking that Willow was finding dead Slayers at random, rather than looking for the ones who needed help the most. Hopefully, those named Slayers have all been forgotten by Joss until this season is safely over. Of course, something is going to happen to all the Slayers this season. Either they won't be Slayers anymore, or they won't be on this plane anymore, or they won't be alive anymore. Knowing that, I hope Joss decides to remove their supernatural powers but have them win the day anyway, thanks to their own inner strength and courage. That would actually be an even better feminist message, as it removes the reliance on forces outside the self -- right now, you could make the argument that it's the magic that's strong, not the women. However, I expect that battle will result in the loss of some familiar faces. I'd be profoundly surprised if it doesn't.
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Mar 7, 2010 12:43:08 GMT -5
Jeanty did say that the Scythe was coming back into play... or at least not forgotten. I hope I'm right that it's in Buffy. I think it might be the source of "the glow," not to mention the reason Buffy is sucking Slayer power, and the reason nobody seems to have noticed the thing is missing. I think we may find that all Slayers' life forces go into the Scythe (or through it, into some harmonic afterlife together) when they die... that that's what happened to Buffy after "The Gift," and why she's felt such a sense of disconnection since being brought back from that.
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Mar 7, 2010 10:01:34 GMT -5
Thanks for taking the time to do these Q&A's for so many months. They really heightened my enjoyment and understanding of the story. I've read a ton of great comics over the years, but I can honestly say I've never read one that made me care so much about the characters, or feel such strong reaction over what they're doing and what's happening to them. Lots of props to you, Georges, the writers, and Evil Hurty Joss...
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Mar 7, 2010 9:39:55 GMT -5
I just noticed in the letter column for this issue, Scott says they asked Felicia Day to write a Vi miniseries and she turned it down. This is interesting to me, because I remember suggesting in a Q&A long ago, before there was ever any announcement of Felicia working with Dark Horse, that this would be a cool thing to do.
I'm not naive enough to think it was my suggestion that prompted them to ask her to write Vi, but I'm disappointed she said no.
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Mar 6, 2010 21:49:21 GMT -5
Sounds like we ticked him off a bit. I wonder if he might be persuaded to do a couple special ones down the road... maybe one during the looooong summer hiatus (4 full months between regular issues), and maybe one when the season is over? With the questions screened to avoid repetition.
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Mar 6, 2010 18:16:41 GMT -5
So Scott's not going to be doing any Q&A's with us anymore? THat's terrible.
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Mar 6, 2010 13:41:00 GMT -5
I love Buffy as much as everyone else here, but I do think fans (myself included) take S8 a little too seriously. This series isn't the be all and end all of the universe, it's a fun little comic book that Joss created to play around with his old characters. It's an indulgence, for both him and us. Yes, there is subtext and it's fun to discuss it, but why don't we stop treating it as Serious Business and try enjoying it instead? I treat it as the canonical continuation of my favorite TV series of all time, possibly my favorite ongoing story of all time, so it has special significance to me that other comics (even very good comics) don't. I (and I think Joss) consider it much more than simply having a lark with old characters... the amount of care and effort that has been put into this story is comparable to that of the show (though obviously with fewer people involved.) And, up until the final page of #33, I have to say I have enjoyed almost every moment of season 8... even parts that most other people seem not to have. (I didn't care for "Swell" at first, but have come to appreciate it much more in hindsight.) I know Joss will tell a good story. But for me, a "good story" and an "enjoyable story" are not necessarily synonyms.
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Mar 6, 2010 12:00:51 GMT -5
It's a complete mystery to me how anyone could have any emotional investment in these characters at all, and not feel disturbed by the direction this story is going.
I guess it all comes down to whether you read this story primarily for the plot or primarily for the characters.
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Mar 6, 2010 10:42:55 GMT -5
Over in the Q&A, Scott Allie denies that they're "mocking" the B/A relationship here, and I certainly agree that's not what they're trying to do.
I have to say, though, that they don't help their case by subtitling the next issue "Them F#@%ing."
At best, that's a crude, snickering, leering attitude to take at what's supposed to be the emotional (if not action) climax of the season. It creates the impression that it's all a joke, and that the creators of this story don't have any respect for the emotions they're creating in us.
Because whatever direction this story is going to go in, right now we're confronted with Buffy having sex with a man whom she was, thirty seconds before, accusing with very good reason of being a mass-murderer of her own friends.
And if it's not disturbing enough to think about the implications of that, the other alternative is that Buffy is currently being made to have sex against her own free will.
Is there any Buffy or Angel fan who doesn't feel at least a bit queasy about this?
So, to luridly title the next episode "Them F#@%ing" makes me wonder if the creators have any respect at all for the story they're telling, or if it's just a job: insert story, collect paycheck, have a laugh.
I hope it's just a case of bad judgment.
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Mar 5, 2010 19:58:45 GMT -5
If this season somehow manages to end with my love for the Buffy character intact, then I will admit that Joss is the one with superpowers here.
Anyway, trying to move beyond my emotional reaction to this issue (grrr) and into the plot points:
Interesting Point 1: Angel tells Buffy "You fundamentally shifted the balance of power in this world... It [the creation of the Slayer army] could never be as simple as you hoped, not on this plane."
This seems pretty dire, because if what he says is true, all of the Slayers are doomed, apart from maybe Buffy and Faith. But then there's that "not on this plane" qualifier...
In "Fray" we see the last Slayer (Buffy) disappearing through a closing portal into what looks like some kind of hell dimension with tentacly creatures in it.
I said a long while ago I suspected season 9 might take place in a world other than this one. Now, it seems the only way to save the Slayers would be to put them in another world where the balance of power would actually benefit from an army of superpowered warriors of good. It would also give Buffy something to do next season, since we know from "Fray" that all magic and demons are going to be banished from this one.
Interesting Point 2. Twangel was hiding his HQ from Buffy by time-shifting it a few seconds into the future. This means she never could have found it unless she knew that secret and had the magical resources to counter it. And the only way that was going to happen was for Amy to tell her.
Since Twangel was clearly waiting around expecting Buffy to show up, he knew that Amy was doing exactly that.
This suggests that Amy, at least, is still actively working for him. She might even be hiding that fact from Warren and the General, who seem to be genuinely resentful of Twilight still.
You might say Angel just knew Amy would run straight to Buffy to spite him when he fired her, but that's leaving an awfully big part of his Master Plan up to blind chance, especially since Amy is not the most predictable of people, and is probably a bit insane.
Interesting Point 3. It's been pointed out that Buffy is the one who starts glowing first when she's near Angel. My theory is that that's because she has the Scythe within her, and the Scythe is the catalyst for everything that's going on now.
I further theorize that when the Slayer power becomes active again (in "Fray") that's because the Scythe (having become unbonded from Buffy, probably due to her death) has found its way back into this world in the hands of Urkonn and his masters. (Maybe the demons who ultimately kill Buffy at last retrieve the Scythe from her.)
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Mar 5, 2010 19:37:12 GMT -5
Angel tells Buffy that the balance of power wouldn't allow the Slayer army to exist without dire consequences "on this plane." (I guess in computer terms, you'd say Buffy was trying to run 6 gigabytes of RAM in a world with a 32-bit operating system.)
Anyway, should we keep our eye on that "not on this plane" qualifier as something possibly significant, or was it just a throwaway?
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Mar 5, 2010 9:17:12 GMT -5
Hey, I just thought of something. Angel was kissing Buffy during the day, maskless. Why isn't he bursting into flame? Same reason Buffy's tree-stake just burst into splinters when she threw it at him. He's magically invulnerable. I have to assume Buffy is too, if their powers are the same. Know what it reminds me of? The Mayor's invulnerability, while he was awaiting his ascension as a True Demon.
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Mar 5, 2010 9:01:16 GMT -5
Looking at current events and the possible directions things can go from here, one really sad thing seems clear: the "Scooby gang"... that wonderful friendship dynamic that's been in place since "Welcome to the Hellmouth", and which has survived all attempts to destroy it in the past... is something we're going to have to say goodbye to. There are lines being crossed now that can never be un-crossed. Is that a fair assessment?
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Mar 4, 2010 22:31:56 GMT -5
i read the issue and still don't know angel plan!!! is it getting buff pregnent??? hehehe!!!! Very likely.
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Mar 4, 2010 20:25:10 GMT -5
Well, one thing that's struck me: Twangel seems to have a real hate-on for Willow for some reason. It's odd.
Almost the moment she reappeared on the scene in TLWH, Twangel and his goons launched an effort to kidnap her specifically, and not just capture or even kill her, but torture her... horrifically. Cutting her eyes out with a scalpel and destroying her magnificent magical mind.
When he speaks to GilesFaithAndrew with his voice undisguised, he says "that's what happens when you're without your resident witch... you see the truth," in an obvious double-reference to Willow. And when Buffy tells him about her power, he contemptuously says "Who told you that? Willow?"
It's all the more odd, because Willow has always been the best friend he's had among the Scoobies apart from Buffy herself. She restored his soul to him, twice. When he came back in season 2, she was the first one to forgive him and accept him as a friend again. When Buffy died in The Gift, it was she who went all the way to L.A. to give him the news in person.
Doesn't add up, but nothing about this Bizarro Angel adds up for me.
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Mar 4, 2010 17:51:44 GMT -5
So what's worse, 40% of the organization or the entire organization? That's Angel's point. If he hadn't done this, everyone (or close to) would have been wiped out. That's what he says. I see no reason whatsoever to believe him, and plenty of evidence not to. Nobody cared about hating on Slayers until Harmony's TV show started (in issue #21), but we saw Twilight in his costume as early as issue #1 He was actively attacking Slayers in the very first arc, and killing them in Time of Your Life. Little too enthusiastic with the "I had to kill them to save them" thing there, Angel.
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Mar 4, 2010 17:24:09 GMT -5
'Only' 206 girls have died. I would have thought A LOT more had. Out of 1800, that means about 1600 Slayers are left. That's in the world... Buffy only had about 500 girls in her organization, so that's 40% of the total. She has no way of knowing how many deaths there have been among the other 1,300.
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Mar 4, 2010 16:16:22 GMT -5
Heh... Paul, our perfect record of 100% disagreement continues unblemished. Seeing them together again, and in such a thrilling context, was just bliss. They are the figureheads of the Buffyverse, and to have them and their relationship actually tied into the fabric and destiny of this universe on a metaphysical level makes perfect sense. It doesn't bother you that their "love" is now revealed to be an artificial construct pushed on them by outside forces, rather than a product of actual emotion? That they're in love because they've been programmed to be? To be honest, it always did seem odd to me how quickly they seemed to fall into "absolute soulmate ultimate true love" over the course of season 1 and 2. I guess this explains it.
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Mar 4, 2010 15:19:21 GMT -5
How exactly is this a betrayal? How is it NOT? Nevermind the obviously mystical nature of the current Buffy/Angel dynamic, you seem beyond determined to criticize anything remotely related to Angel. You compared him to Hitler. I must assume you haven't watched his show because it's difficult to see how you could come to this conclusion if you had. I own and have watched every episode. And I have to assume you haven't read the comic if you could possibly miss the comparison. Taking it upon yourself to rid the world of an inconvenient minority group is kinda hard to miss. What murder have we actually seen Twilight commit? None to my recollection. You could argue that he was commanding others but that makes the unwarranted assumption that all those other attacks wouldn't have happend had Twilight never existed. Uh... yes, I could argue that he was commanding others. The missile shot from TWILIGHT'S HQ at Slayer HQ in Time of Your Life. The military attacks on the Scotland base and the Tibet base by TWILIGHT'S military forces. Sending a boatload of Vampy Cats to infiltrate and kill the world's children, led by a demon loudly proclaiming allegiance to TWILIGHT. His minions Amy and Warren sending demons into the Rome catacombs to attack and kill hiding Slayers. TWILIGHT ordering one of his own minions summarily executed for supposedly failing him. And we have no evidence whatsoever that the public even knew about Slayers until Harmony's TV show... and Twilight had already been hunting and killing Slayers on his own, long before that. And please don't believe I'm going to be drawn into a flamewar here. I'm not going over all of this again.
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Post by AndrewCrossett on Mar 4, 2010 14:54:16 GMT -5
That's precisely my point. It is self destructive. And she will have to learn to move beyond them. But just because she's the big hero, doesn't mean the right thing to do is going to come to her so easily. This isn't the first time she's done something like this, either. This time, though, it's more than a mistake. It's a betrayal... of her friends, of her Slayers, and of herself. Mistakes can be forgiven, although one has to wonder how many times that has to happen before it turns into a sucker's game. But betrayal can't be forgiven quite so easily.
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