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Post by faithnspike on Jan 23, 2009 16:20:10 GMT -5
She also was just as much to blame for finch’s death as Faith she set him up Faith stabbed him in season 3. it was a team killing. It always made me mad that Buffy didn’t seem to blame herself at all for his death
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Post by Wyndam on Jan 23, 2009 16:29:42 GMT -5
She also was just as much to blame for finch’s death as Faith she set him up Faith stabbed him in season 3. it was a team killing. It always made me mad that Buffy didn’t seem to blame herself at all for his death I don't think you can really say that Buffy is "as much to blame" for the Deputy Mayor's death. While Buffy did touch him first, when he surprised them, she realized immediately that she was human, and even tried to warn Faith that he wasn't a vampire before Faith killed him. That isn't really a team effort when one of the "team members" actively sets out to avoid the victim's death. Faith acted all on her own and wasn't influenced in any way by Buffy in the Deputy Mayor's death. And Buffy definitely blamed herself for his death. She was so racked with guilt that she turned Faith in, and effectively destroyed the trust between her and Faith. Buffy was in the wrong place at the wrong time, but she was not to blame for the Deputy Mayor's death. Her only fault in the situation was not going to Giles right away. |
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Post by Skytteflickan88 on Jan 23, 2009 17:32:03 GMT -5
I agree with Wyndam, although I would like to add that it since there was no intention, neither is to blame. But you could argue that Faith's lack of respect of human life was that made her careless enough not to notice that he was human, so on a subconscious level, she is more to blame than Buffy. And she's definitly to blame for her indifference afterwards, even tough she later redeemed herself.
Also "set him up"? It was a while since I saw the scene so I don't see what you mean.
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Post by wenxina on Jan 23, 2009 18:05:34 GMT -5
By set him up, I think faithnspike meant Buffy "prepped" Finch for the staking. Kinda like tag-teaming, where one essentially opens up the victim/opponent for the hit. There's a whole realm of sports-lingo that I'm deficient in, so I hope that helped.
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Post by faithnspike on Jan 23, 2009 18:35:04 GMT -5
Yep exactly what I meant watch the scene again and you will see Buffy almost throw him at Faith. The reaction of Faith was what made her evil but Buffy did not realize that he was human anymore than Faith
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Post by Skytteflickan88 on Jan 23, 2009 18:35:16 GMT -5
Thanks Wenxina, Most Helpful person *wink wink, hint hint*
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Saturn 5
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Post by Saturn 5 on Jan 24, 2009 11:16:46 GMT -5
Actually it's probably easier to figure out which scoobies haven't killed humans?
Buffy; The Knights and Caleb
Willow; Warren and Rack
Giles; Ben
Angel(us) Wolfram and Hart SWAT team leader amongst others
Oz; Veruca
Anya; countless whilst a demon
Faith; deputy Mayor and Professor
Cordy; sacrifice whilst evil/Lilah
Spike; countless whilst evil
Not counting the Potentials the only Scoobies never to kill humans are;
1.Xander (although he surely would have killed Ben to save Buffy and Dawn, he's the one who comes up with the idea)
2. Dawn
3. Tara
4. Oddly enough, Riley
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Enisy
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Post by Enisy on Jan 24, 2009 12:21:14 GMT -5
Xander did indirectly kill a bunch of people in Once More, With Feeling, by summoning Sweet.
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Saturn 5
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Post by Saturn 5 on Jan 24, 2009 14:19:18 GMT -5
Good point but he didn't know what he was doing, otherwise you could hold Buffy responsible for all the people Angelus killed?
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Post by Skytteflickan88 on Jan 24, 2009 18:25:47 GMT -5
You could argue that Xander couldn't possibly be stupid enough not to realize that his sing-dancing-spell was the same as the singing-dancing-spell that killed people. But that's another thread.
Veruca wasn't technically human and I'm nor sure Rack was either. Not that it matters, The BEEPS had it coming.
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Nicholas
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Post by Nicholas on Jan 24, 2009 19:03:44 GMT -5
I don't think it was bad judgement when it came to killing Anya because she knew what she had to do. Angel didn't have a choice when it came to killing people but Anya did, not to mention that Anya never showed remorse to Buffy over what she did when she showed up.
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Nicholas
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Post by Nicholas on Jan 26, 2009 13:26:29 GMT -5
Buffy in no way whatsoever, set Faith up to kill Finch. She clearly told her to stop before she stabbed him but it was too late.
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Post by faithnspike on Jan 27, 2009 7:49:59 GMT -5
yah but she threw him to faith first. She didn't realize he was human until it was to late. Just because she told Faith to stop does not mean she didn’t help cause his death to begin with
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Nicholas
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Post by Nicholas on Jan 27, 2009 14:04:00 GMT -5
They were both mistaken but Buffy clearly attempted to make it clear to Faith in that last second not to do it. Slayers are supposed to be able to have amazing reflexes and the fact that Faith was all about the kill is what played into that.
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Post by Skytteflickan88 on Jan 27, 2009 16:31:59 GMT -5
To be fair to Faith, Buffy did have more experience than Faith, so that could have played a part in her seeing that he was human.
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Post by henzINNIT on Jan 27, 2009 17:52:41 GMT -5
Physically switch Buffy and Faith that night. Would Buffy have noticed before stabbing him? Tough call. Faith was quite reckless but it was a tense situation at the time and Buffy may have only figured it out quicker because she had those moments of physical contact first.
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gonzalo84
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Post by gonzalo84 on Jan 27, 2009 18:56:06 GMT -5
Actually it's probably easier to figure out which scoobies haven't killed humans? Buffy; The Knights and Caleb Willow; Warren and Rack Giles; Ben Angel(us) Wolfram and Hart SWAT team leader amongst others Oz; Veruca Anya; countless whilst a demon Faith; deputy Mayor and Professor Cordy; sacrifice whilst evil/Lilah Spike; countless whilst evil Not counting the Potentials the only Scoobies never to kill humans are; 1.Xander (although he surely would have killed Ben to save Buffy and Dawn, he's the one who comes up with the idea) 2. Dawn 3. Tara 4. Oddly enough, Riley Cordelia never killed humans. That was Jasmine in Cordy's body. |
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Nicholas
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Post by Nicholas on Jan 28, 2009 13:28:25 GMT -5
It may not have ended like that had Buffy been switched with Faith. Look how fast she stopped when Willow told her not to kill Vamp Willow.
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Saturn 5
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Post by Saturn 5 on Jan 28, 2009 14:13:15 GMT -5
Actually it's probably easier to figure out which scoobies haven't killed humans? Buffy; The Knights and Caleb Willow; Warren and Rack Giles; Ben Angel(us) Wolfram and Hart SWAT team leader amongst others Oz; Veruca Anya; countless whilst a demon Faith; deputy Mayor and Professor Cordy; sacrifice whilst evil/Lilah Spike; countless whilst evil Not counting the Potentials the only Scoobies never to kill humans are; 1.Xander (although he surely would have killed Ben to save Buffy and Dawn, he's the one who comes up with the idea) 2. Dawn 3. Tara 4. Oddly enough, Riley Cordelia never killed humans. That was Jasmine in Cordy's body. Possessed Cordy, sure, no argument there. As for Buffy/Faith it could easily have Buffy who killed him, as Giles says it's happened before. It's Faith's actions afterwards that matter. I have sympathy with Faith but it only goes so far |
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Post by Skytteflickan88 on Jan 28, 2009 23:43:03 GMT -5
It may not have ended like that had Buffy been switched with Faith. Look how fast she stopped when Willow told her not to kill Vamp Willow. Well, Buffy could have been ready to stop so quickly because it would hurt her to dust Willow, even if it's not her Willow. |
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