Paul
Ensouled Vampire
[Mo0:34]
Posts: 1,173
|
Post by Paul on Oct 8, 2010 12:08:10 GMT -5
I was surprised by how much I liked this issue, considering how annoyed I've been with the series lately. Buffy was in character and it was a relief to finally get some explanation of her actions in "Twilight" and how much free will she had. So far we've only been inferring that she was under a mystical influence so it's nice to know that, yes, the "universe" had something to do with it (even if she was enjoying herself).
So many nice one-on-one character scenes. Dawn and Xander's scene was sweet... I hope it's only a mislead that Dawn will die because it's too predictable otherwise. Faith and Giles' scene was much-needed... their storyline has been lingering and underdeveloped since "NFFY", hopefully we'll see a Season Nine spin-off born out of this scene. Angel, however, was a little annoying with his obnoxious, too-little-too-late attempts to be a hero.
Not having any explanation for the Master being back was weird, as was Buffy's non-reaction to him. I think he might be the First in corporeal form... wasn't that an aborted story point in S7? I remember reading an original script for "Chosen" where a hand bursts out of the ruins of Sunnydale. I don't really get what's going on there, hopefully there'll be some explanation next issue.
|
|
will86
Innocent Bystander
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 2
|
Post by will86 on Oct 8, 2010 13:05:57 GMT -5
I liked the issue, as many had said it was dynamic and I'm just dying to know what will be the role of Angel, the kitty son, and Dawn. Her because I'm still thinking that the character will be removed or changed in an unexpected way, and she is actually a part of Buffy and even when many of us don't exactly love her as much as the others, affecting her is breaking the only family link of our favorite slayer . About the covers of the last issue, I just didn't like them haha. I don't like the way the scythe looks, I understand the intention of destroying it as a symbol, but even when we know the buffyverse will change I don't love the way the last cover leave us in terms of seeing our "hero" like she failed. But well, again, I understand the intention. And I also hope that the Frayverse doesn't match the Buffy timeline as easy as it seems at this point. We'll see.
|
|
|
Post by angel215 on Oct 9, 2010 11:47:58 GMT -5
wow from the revies i read this will be a great addition!!! i am currently unale to get this eddition. so could i ask if someone could post some pics of the buffy/spike imaginary make out seen please!!!?? that will be the best part!
|
|
|
Post by krazyxxxdj on Oct 9, 2010 23:43:37 GMT -5
No breaking news to add, just my usual theories and speculations, which are always wrong anyway.
With the hints and covers and everything that's been discussed, I'm thinking of some theories about the betrayer.
I'm a little peeved that some Power That Be / Higher Being has manipulated Angel, again. Are we going there, again? I don't see it being him anymore. Or Spike. Spike was brought in a little too late to be some big surprise now.
I agree that Dawn will end up being some huge factor, if not THE betrayer. Maybe Joss is going to pull an Angel: Season 5(?) Cordelia switch here where Dawn is really connected with that big beast at the end. We really don't know a whole lot about "The Key" pre-Dawn. It's brought up again that she was The Key. Normally I wouldn't say Joss would re-use the Cordelia/villian idea but this has been brought up enough like it's there to remind us, and let people who might have missed it know. Plus, the scene with Xander/Dawn and then the upcoming cover of him carrying her body - maybe "The Key" has left her body or been extracted at that point? Maybe she's had something inside of her the whole time - who knows. I can only guess, but it's fishy right now. Like stated above, it's a family bond, so that could qualify as a really hard betrayal.
I just don't see it being Willow. Now it's just too obvious.
I'm wondering if the Faith/Giles talk was about the CURRENT situation, or are they discussing some sinister plan of their own? Is Giles getting Faith ready to replace Buffy in some way? It's a possibility, but betrayal by either is hardly something new.
Lastly, something makes me think that the whole group is going to turn on Buffy. I know covers aren't great clues, but I can't think of any reason they'd put him alone on one like that.
IDK.
|
|
|
Post by VampSlayer on Oct 10, 2010 4:24:20 GMT -5
I won't deny it: This issue has been the best in a long time. While I still think this season has been one, big, giant mess of plot, it's starting to get better in the end. This issue improved on the last few arcs, thank Joss. First of all: Buffy was in character. (*Gasp*?) Spike/Buffy actually got some good interaction. (Why wasn't this in #36, again?) Those are probably the two core things that made me happy. But besides those, every other character got some of the spotlight. Xander and Dawn had a good scene, as did Giles and Faith. And can I just say, again, how much I love Willow this season? If Season Eight has done one thing for me, it's shown me how much I love Willow. I cannot wait to see her in the SPIKE Series, and also see what's to come for her in these upcoming issues. Next issue, we need some explanation about The Master. He's there... But why? Why is he 'the Protector' of 'the Seed?' (Randomly thrown in here, but I still don't understand how Angel and Buffy getting dirty made another universe. I think this kinda adds to my 'mess of plot' complaint about this Season.) And let me get this straight: If the Seed is destroyed, the world will be saved, but most magic will be destroyed as well? Damn. That's pretty awesome. Here we come, Fray! Wait,... If Buffy is trying to protect the Seed, why is The Master fighting her, if he's its 'Protector'? My head hurts. Okay, I give this issue 9/10. Had good character moments, and is so much better than the issues we were getting before. I still am upset with the overall plot. Why was vampires 'coming out of the coffin' needed this season again? And I also am not a big fan of the art still, sorry. The writing was great.
|
|
BlueJay
Descendant of a Toaster Oven
Resident Charmed Fan[Mo0:12]
Posts: 631
|
Post by BlueJay on Oct 10, 2010 4:29:46 GMT -5
I agree with you on mostly everything, especially the part about the Master. It's like Buffy isn't even phased he's there and the thought of his return used to terrify her. Also, I'm not liking this whole seed business. MacGuffin anyone?
Anyway, I respectfully disagree with you on the art. I think it's amazing and I don't think the characters have ever been captured this well in one issue.
|
|
moscowwatcher
Potential Slayer
You're the one, Buffy[Mo0:0]
Posts: 106
|
Post by moscowwatcher on Oct 10, 2010 8:31:46 GMT -5
so could i ask if someone could post some pics of the buffy/spike imaginary make out seen please!!!?? that will be the best part! Enjoy! Looks like Buffy and Spike are more or less in the place where Joss has left them in the end of season 7. Buffy cares about Spike, wants to be with him, but the circumstances work against her. Spike, as usual, thinks that she doesn't care about him. She is embarrassed and can't find words to explain that she cares. So the audience knows that she fantasizes about Spike while the object of her affection is absolutely sure that she only thinks about Angel. To me, this is a clear indication that writers want fans to root for the couple. Lost opportunities are the surest way to make the audience feel for the characters. It was delightful to discover that Spuffy magic hasn't gone after all these years, after the change of the medum, and, very importantly, the introduction of a new writer. In the past, Scott Allie was very critical of the couple, so it's a nice surprise to see him write Spuffy at its best - snarky, funny, honest, completely trusting each other, comfortable with each other's flaws and inexorably drawn to each other. Buffy (about space-frak): "It wasn't our fault." -- "Nobody says it was, except me right now in your face." Classic Spuffy. Interestingly, Buffy's fantasy about sex with Spike is vaguely reminiscent of the love scene in "Innocence". Spike and Angel have switched their traditional places in Buffy's love life; now Buffy's sex with Angel is destructive and wild, while her daydreams about sex with Spike have sweet and intimate vibe. And Spike still considers Buffy his hero, despite her space-frak with Angel. That said, I don't expect hearts and puppies for Buffy and Spike. (It's so liberating to have zero expectations. You always win.) I expect a lot of UST, unnuendos, quiproquos and more lost opportunities to keep fans in constant alert mode. But I don't think there will be a real Spuffy romance unless Joss finds a way to make it *very* painful for Buffy. A Twangel-level painful. So far, I see a possibility of Spike/Faith romance to make Buffy jealous in season 9. But, surely, Joss will come up with something more devious to torture us and our girl. What happens next? I wish I knew. Looks like The Master is Buffy's ally now: they both want to protect the Seed, although Buffy's priority is to protect the Earth. Looks like The Master thinks that Buffy and Spike came to remove the Seed and to give it to Miss Kitty Twilight. Looks like Buffy doesn't know about the consequences of the Seed's destruction. Willow didn't tell her (lie by omission). Hard to say if Spike knows - he could know and he could have told Buffy when she was daydreaming about sex with him. Willow's goal is to protect The Seed at any cost. And, most likely, Twangel has got an order to bring it to Miss Kitty Twilight. The face-off will be quite intense, and I guess that Angel's mission puts him against the rest of the team. We know that after the betrayal the Seed will look like it has hatched, which goes well with current "birthing a Universe" twist. It's grotesque, but possible. If Buffy and Angel have procreated a universe, the Seed with the Master's help could procreate something to fight against it. Or maybe the partial damage of the Seed we saw on the "betrayal" flashforward panel in #10 is supposed to mean it's destroyed. I wonder if Miss Kitty Twilight is the final Big Bad in the long file of season 8 Big Bads or it's a manifestation of somebody (something) else? If Buffy's dreams are supposed to be clues, then the real Big Bad must be the gigantic monster from her very first dream, in #2. But I admit, the plot leaves me utterly confused. I don't understard how The Master can be alive and why Buffy isn't surprised about it. I can't wrap my mind around the idea of not-yet-born Twilight manifesting itself through people and animals. Moreover, I'm not sure that an alternate universe as a Big Bad is a good idea. Non-personified evil in a visual medium is usually boring and unconvincing. But I doubt that anybody in the audience really cares much about all those exotic McGuffins, though. The only question people debate is the identity of the traitor. And, frankly, I'm mostly interested in the identity of the traitor, too. So far, I think it's Angel. If there is a fight, the only person who can match Buffy in strength is Angel. Of course, Willow could turn him into a frog for a moment, but I think the frog panel was inserted only for laughs. Plot-wise, no-one is safe -- but, most likely Joss will go for the maximum pain. "The closest, the most unexpected". That's how Buffy sees Angel currently: her heart belongs to him and she wants to spend the rest of her life with him. That's how Angel has been positioned in Buffy's threesome dream: Angel as "the closest". If the look at the situation from the outside, Jeanty said - and then confirmed - that something terrible will happen to Buffy/Angel relationship. Dark Horse has already announced that Angel will have his own title the next season, so he won't die in season 8. I think it leaves only one option. Besides, it's Joss. One of the prevalent mistakes in BtVS fandom is attributing IWRY script to Joss Whedon (I swear, it's not a non-sequitur). But he isn't the writer of IWRY. David Greenwalt and Jeannine Renshaw are - and I think Joss was unhappy that Greenwalt got all the sadistical fun to himself. So in season 8 Joss wrote his own version of IWRY. Again, Angel gets manipulated by dubious higher beings who promise that bad things will happen to Buffy unless Angel hurt her for her own good. Again, Angel believes them and acts accordingly, thinking that he is a noble savior. And again he fails spectacularly. His decision in IWRY didn't prevent Buffy's death in "The Gift". His decision to become Twilight doesn't save the world. What's even more curious - Twangel arc in season 8 echoes crucial moments in the journeys of the majority of AtS regulars. Angel is corrupted with power and becomes what he hates, like Gunn in season 5; Angel creates a catastrophe by trying to prevent it, like Wesley in season 3; Angel involuntarily becomes a father of an entity that wants to ruin our world and create a new one, as Connor in season 4. So I guess, in a broader sense, it's Joss' take on AtS, uncensored and unlimited. I wonder if according to this new, Jossian mythology, all Angel's journey was about this moment; that's why PTB (or was it Miss Kitty Twilight?) sent Angel to help Buffy back in 1996; that's why W&H couldn't kill him all along. And you thought Greenwalt's take on Angel was dark. It's scary to think what Joss could do to Angel if he'd run the show. (I'm not sure I like what he did to Angel. My personal take on Angel is that he is very flawed - and I like him that way. But the panel where he tries to keep Buffy to himself in the Twilight paradize when her sister and her friends are dying on Earth - that panel makes me cringe. Just a week ago me and my fandom friends were rewatching earlier AtS episodes and it felt like mourning the character.) I have to admit that I have a couple of cognitive dissonances with Miss Kitty Twilight. BtVS consistently depicted felines as a symbol of female power; it's strange that a Big Bad has manifested as a feline. My second gripe is about "birthing" the Bad Universe. Birthing experience as something negative? Evil baby? On a feminist show? It's so bizarre that I wonder if Miss Kitty Twilight is a gigantic hoax and the real Big Bad hasn't appeared yet. But, most likely, this Big Bad is the final one. The plot is so convoluted that adding another twist would be an overkill. Unless it's Connor who's behind it -- y'know, because he thinks that having a little sister would be fun. (He should have asked Buffy first.)
|
|
|
Post by AndrewCrossett on Oct 10, 2010 9:00:03 GMT -5
Interesting... the problem I have with the idea of Angel being the betrayer is that I don't think it wouldn't be "the most unexpected." He's been working against Buffy all season, and while I'm sure Buffy hopes he's back on her side now, she's not foolish enough to take that for granted.
Scott hinted that something terrible was going to happen to Angel. I envision something similar to Angel season 3, when Connor got taken to another dimension and Angel thought he'd never see him again... only this time, the Apocalypse results in Buffy getting sent to another dimension while Angel gets left behind (or vice versa). And it would be even worse for him if Spike wound up in the same dimension as Buffy.
|
|
|
Post by buffyfan21 on Oct 10, 2010 11:24:13 GMT -5
Read this issue twice already and love it! The Buffy/Spike interaction is awesome (definitely the best part of the issue for me. The voices were in character and everything was great), and Buffy's daydream about Spike -hilarious! I thought it was really happening until I realized it wasn't! Haha. Nice mislead there. The Dawn/Xander stuff was cute, but it makes me worry even more for Dawn's safety.
|
|
moscowwatcher
Potential Slayer
You're the one, Buffy[Mo0:0]
Posts: 106
|
Post by moscowwatcher on Oct 10, 2010 13:16:04 GMT -5
Interesting... the problem I have with the idea of Angel being the betrayer is that I don't think it wouldn't be "the most unexpected." He's been working against Buffy all season, and while I'm sure Buffy hopes he's back on her side now, she's not foolish enough to take that for granted. Scott hinted that something terrible was going to happen to Angel. I envision something similar to Angel season 3, when Connor got taken to another dimension and Angel thought he'd never see him again... only this time, the Apocalypse results in Buffy getting sent to another dimension while Angel gets left behind (or vice versa). And it would be even worse for him if Spike wound up in the same dimension as Buffy. As far as I remember, "the closest, the most unexpected" was mentioned only once, in #10, when Buffy didn't know Twilight's identity. Back in #10 Angel was the most unexpected. And right now, when Buffy declared that Angel is the one she wants to spend her life with, he qualifies as the closest. I don't know if we pay too much attention to concrete words. These words could get in the way of bigger picture, so we can't see a forest behind trees. (I often wonder if my attitude to Twilight arc is heavily influenced by my shipping preferences.)
|
|
|
Post by AndrewCrossett on Oct 10, 2010 13:31:52 GMT -5
As far as I remember, "the closest, the most unexpected" was mentioned only once, in #10, when Buffy didn't know Twilight's identity. Back in #10 Angel was the most unexpected. But in the #40 solicitations, they still say: "betrayal comes in the shape of the closest, most unexpected individual of all."
To me, at this point, that says Xander.
|
|
|
Post by drywallman on Oct 10, 2010 13:46:21 GMT -5
As far as I remember, "the closest, the most unexpected" was mentioned only once, in #10, when Buffy didn't know Twilight's identity. Back in #10 Angel was the most unexpected. But in the #40 solicitations, they still say: "betrayal comes in the shape of the closest, most unexpected individual of all."
To me, at this point, that says Xander. Or Dawn.
|
|
Hellbound Hyperion
Bad Ass Wicca
$20 per soul, no refunds[/B]
Dude, you just rescued a puppy![Mo0:18]
Posts: 2,268
|
Post by Hellbound Hyperion on Oct 10, 2010 13:57:20 GMT -5
Finally got this issue yesterday. There's too much chaos in my life to properly state my feelings on it, but I'm still riding the wave because this story has got me so hooked.
|
|
mary
Innocent Bystander
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 5
|
Post by mary on Oct 10, 2010 14:02:42 GMT -5
Wow, I had no idea that Scott is gonna publish my letter which I wrote him in early summer... I thought my English is too bad for my letter to be published (I'm from Russia). Anyway, glad that he responded on it. Glad to know he isn't a spuffy hater. I just felt really broken and sad after what he said about Spike and I think comparing Spike to Angel was kind of a double standard, that's why I wrote him this letter. I didn't try to say that Angel was bad or anything, but I deffinitely don't see him better than Spike, you know... Both vampires had their good and bad sides. I also loved those Joss quotes about Spuffy and decided to share with Scott.
I was kinda dissappointed in the last issue (number 36), because it seemed like Spuffy wasn't treated with any respect, as if Buffy didn't even care for Spike... But in this issue we can see that she really does and thay she actually loves him. Though I agree with the majority here who thinks that Buffy acts OOC in S8. Also I didn't like the fact that Buffy dreams about sex with Spike after having sex with Angel... She seems like a horny school girl and deffinitely not Buffy from S5-7. Though Spuffy scenes in this issue where sweet.
Haven't been here for long time, but I've been reading Slay Alive quite often.
|
|
moscowwatcher
Potential Slayer
You're the one, Buffy[Mo0:0]
Posts: 106
|
Post by moscowwatcher on Oct 10, 2010 14:29:38 GMT -5
But in the #40 solicitations, they still say: "betrayal comes in the shape of the closest, most unexpected individual of all."
To me, at this point, that says Xander. I admit I don't know much how comics publishing works, but I suspect these solicitations were written by the same people who list Spike as "former vampire" on one of their blurbs. They have to write their solicitations as shocking as possible to make people buy the issue. Than again, I don't know. I'm afraid I become too attached to the story - I feel so close that I become myopic. Mary - you're my hero! I was thrilled to discover your letter! BTW, do you post on Russian BtVS community, here? buffy-angel.diary.ru/
|
|
|
Post by VampSlayer on Oct 10, 2010 14:31:35 GMT -5
As far as I remember, "the closest, the most unexpected" was mentioned only once, in #10, when Buffy didn't know Twilight's identity. Back in #10 Angel was the most unexpected. But in the #40 solicitations, they still say: "betrayal comes in the shape of the closest, most unexpected individual of all."
To me, at this point, that says Xander. I totally think it's Giles or Xander. And right now, I'm leaning towards Giles.
|
|
mary
Innocent Bystander
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 5
|
Post by mary on Oct 10, 2010 14:41:53 GMT -5
I also think it might be Giles... Which totally sucks. moscowwatcher - Loved your review on this issue, I left my comment in your LJ I don't really take the comics seriously. I read them sometimes for fun, that's all. But I do care about Spuffy always. For sure I have to visit this community. I've only been posting on a few fan-forums dedicated to BTVS and ATS.
|
|
|
Post by PJ on Oct 10, 2010 16:11:50 GMT -5
Very awesome issue! Looks like S8 is starting to get back on track, at least for me! and not a huge Spuffy fan, but i loved the parts with Buffy and Spike together. and Mary, kudos for getting your letter published! and the reference to Slayalive was pretty cool! ;D
|
|
The Night Lord
Wise-cracking Sidekick
The Long Kiss Goodnight
There can be no love. Only pain exists[Mo0:1]
Posts: 2,654
|
Post by The Night Lord on Oct 10, 2010 22:10:35 GMT -5
I wanna see Faith's reaction to Angel is Twilight. Really, I do. Because this is the only guy (apart from probably Giles) that she really trusted and was good friends with and now he has pretty much betrayed her trust. I'm guessing we probably won't see it in this season, but hopefully in season 9
|
|
|
Post by AndrewCrossett on Oct 10, 2010 22:32:56 GMT -5
I wanna see Faith's reaction to Angel is Twilight. Really, I do. Because this is the only guy (apart from probably Giles) that she really trusted and was good friends with and now he has pretty much betrayed her trust. I'm guessing we probably won't see it in this season, but hopefully in season 9 Well, I believe she referred to him as "the man-bitch formerly known as Angel" last issue.
|
|