patxshand
Ensouled Vampire
Writer/director/Amy Acker's husband.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,918
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Post by patxshand on Nov 18, 2010 16:45:46 GMT -5
No, I'm with you kind of. Just playing a bit of devil's advocate. Unrestrained human emotion is illogical, for sure, but Connor hasn't had that kind of illogical outburst since he was Annoying!Connor in Season Four. I like to think that Connor has grown past outbursts that defy logic, especially since he was in a leadership position at the time the argument went down.
But really, in retrospect, I don't mind it much... thanks to Mariah and David's new take on the thing. When Connor looks back at it, he recognizes that he is perfectly in the right with being uncomfortable with Gunn, but wrong in how he went about it. Works for me and it, much like James as a villain retroactively makes a lot of "Aftermath" work, serves to make what I considered Willingham's low point a lot more readable.
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patxshand
Ensouled Vampire
Writer/director/Amy Acker's husband.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,918
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Post by patxshand on Nov 18, 2010 15:18:59 GMT -5
Which is illustrated again in #23, when he is enraged that Non heals him. He didn't want to go to the ER. He wanted to die because of what he'd done. The guilt, for him, is still fresh. And if Gunn hasn't forgiven himself, why should Connor? That's all I'm saying. The guilt is still fresh for Gunn, but the trauma is just as fresh for Connor. S'all I'm saying. It's not about forgiveness, it's about Connor's disproportionate reaction. He can carry a grudge all he wants, but to compare the Connor's death threat to Gunn's guilt would be to expect Gunn walking around the Hyperion months later contemplating suicide.
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patxshand
Ensouled Vampire
Writer/director/Amy Acker's husband.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,918
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Post by patxshand on Nov 18, 2010 10:07:52 GMT -5
Connor is what... 18 during "AtF". Given that Willingham's arc quickly followed "Aftermath", which more or less immediately followed "AtF", Connor's possibly still around the 18 mark. I wouldn't call shenanigans on him being a tad immature about his murder. Hell, I wouldn't call out a person who was 40 if he was bitter about being stabbed to death. I don't know. If the dialogue was different, I might have taken that from it too. But Connor's dialogue just seemed incongruous with the situation. Didn't say it was atonement. My point was that the weight of Gunn's actions as a vampire was crushing for him, even as a human. In the alley, he remembered everything. He remembered all his actions in hell. He saw Angel dust the man who turned him. He didn't think that being vamped was an option at all any more, so it wasn't about that. He just wanted to die because of the guilt. Which is illustrated again in #23, when he is enraged that Non heals him. He didn't want to go to the ER. He wanted to die because of what he'd done. The guilt, for him, is still fresh.
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patxshand
Ensouled Vampire
Writer/director/Amy Acker's husband.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,918
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Post by patxshand on Nov 18, 2010 8:59:15 GMT -5
Pat, I think you're giving vampire!Gunn a pass he doesn't deserve. Angel with a soul still feels responsible for all the evil he did before. So does Spike. The difference to me isn't the vampire/human deal but that Gunn had lost his soul. And if Angel and Spike have to own the evil they did, so does Gunn. So Gunn needs to eat his lumps. He murdered Connor. Connor died because of him and he remembers it. Gunn should expect Connor wanting to kill him--it's to Connor's credit that he's only verbalizing it. Oh, not giving him a complete pass. Gunn feels responsible. He begged Angel to let him die in the alley. However, looking at the big picture, Connor--at this point--should know that Gunn wasn't really in control of his actions. While you're absolutely right about Gunn having to own his evil actions, I think Connor's viewpoint during Willingham's arc was an oversimplification of things. He hated Gunn and wanted him dead; working with the guy disgusted Connor. I can see why Connor would be uncomfortable, but it seemed like a very immature reaction to something that's a lot more complicated that "I died, you killed me, f*** you." Not really to me, because that's not how it reads. Gunn isn't most upset about that, it's just needless salt on an open, gushing wound.
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patxshand
Ensouled Vampire
Writer/director/Amy Acker's husband.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,918
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Post by patxshand on Nov 17, 2010 21:57:48 GMT -5
If Gunn had killed Connor as a human, I'd agree. As much as the guilt is there in Gunn, he was a vampire who was completely out of control of his own actions. So to be honest, Connor's offense is up there. It's hard to weigh it, because I can sympathize with both of them. They're both traumatized from the events of AtF in very different ways. Despite that one outburst, though, Connor seems much less upset about the happenings of that arc than Gunn does.
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patxshand
Ensouled Vampire
Writer/director/Amy Acker's husband.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,918
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Post by patxshand on Nov 17, 2010 21:18:18 GMT -5
Thing about Gunn, he has a right to be angry at Connor. Connor randomly told Gunn that he kept wanting to slit his throat. Gunn did kill Connor when he was a vampire, but Connor was needlessly cruel when they argued.
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patxshand
Ensouled Vampire
Writer/director/Amy Acker's husband.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,918
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Post by patxshand on Nov 17, 2010 18:13:07 GMT -5
I was skeptical too, but it totally works. Coming out of my fandomy retreat to send something derrishis your way. buffyversecomics.blogspot.com/2010/11/interview-with-mariah-huehner-and.htmlMaaaaaaaaan, the comic was good. Felt like a new beginning, but the tone was consistent and the characters were super in character. A breath of fresh air. Can't wait to see how Mariah and David end what has been my favorite comic series of all time. Viva la IDW's Angel! Check out my interview with Mariah at NYCC and also my review of #39. Link above. If that alone doesn't convince you to click, the second interview video (a few scrolls down) features Mariah and my girlfriend geeking out about how cool squids are.
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patxshand
Ensouled Vampire
Writer/director/Amy Acker's husband.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,918
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Post by patxshand on Nov 11, 2010 9:48:49 GMT -5
I posted a whole thing, but that's kinda lame.
I think this is my goodbye to Slay Alive forums. It's been fun while it's been positive. Hope those who read my blog (hey there, you three!) still enjoy it. And kudos to those who respect good and dedicated writers.
Hasta.
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patxshand
Ensouled Vampire
Writer/director/Amy Acker's husband.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,918
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Post by patxshand on Oct 23, 2010 18:18:29 GMT -5
Of course they know.
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patxshand
Ensouled Vampire
Writer/director/Amy Acker's husband.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,918
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Post by patxshand on Oct 16, 2010 17:22:55 GMT -5
Good points, Paul!
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patxshand
Ensouled Vampire
Writer/director/Amy Acker's husband.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,918
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Post by patxshand on Oct 14, 2010 9:57:47 GMT -5
It's more consistent with Buffy. "Immortality for Dummies" came out a month or two after the arc ended. I'd say probably in December for this, but the date isn't accurate.
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patxshand
Ensouled Vampire
Writer/director/Amy Acker's husband.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,918
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Post by patxshand on Oct 14, 2010 7:56:00 GMT -5
Is the amazon release date reliable? Maybe I don't have to wait two months. No, it's not reliable.
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patxshand
Ensouled Vampire
Writer/director/Amy Acker's husband.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,918
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Post by patxshand on Oct 14, 2010 7:55:13 GMT -5
Yes, in AtF, everyone's memories are restored. Especially Connor's. He remembers shit that happened to him even when he was first born.
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patxshand
Ensouled Vampire
Writer/director/Amy Acker's husband.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,918
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Post by patxshand on Oct 13, 2010 17:05:25 GMT -5
It's super tongue in cheek.
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patxshand
Ensouled Vampire
Writer/director/Amy Acker's husband.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,918
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Post by patxshand on Oct 13, 2010 16:31:36 GMT -5
They're barely in the scene together. They bust some vampire heads in and then Spike splits.
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patxshand
Ensouled Vampire
Writer/director/Amy Acker's husband.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,918
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Post by patxshand on Oct 13, 2010 14:44:04 GMT -5
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patxshand
Ensouled Vampire
Writer/director/Amy Acker's husband.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,918
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Post by patxshand on Oct 13, 2010 9:18:29 GMT -5
I almost wonder if there could be some special licensing deal where the Spike series could stay in-house at IDW, eventually becoming part of season 9, with the season 9 part co-owned by DH and IDW. Even after the news of the license going back to DH, there seemed to be some uncertainty over whether the Spike series would end next year after 8 issues or not. Seems like there wouldn't be any question about that unless something was being talked about. Hm, if there was any ambiguity, I'm pretty sure it was unintentional. SPIKE goes for eight issues, then Dark Horse takes it, unfortunately. This story is going to be great, and I'm confident it'll be the best SPIKE story ever told, but I'm itching for more. Does anyone know if Lynch is under exclusive contract to IDW? He's not.
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patxshand
Ensouled Vampire
Writer/director/Amy Acker's husband.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,918
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Post by patxshand on Oct 12, 2010 15:06:27 GMT -5
There's the normal Urru cover, the Frison cover, the Urru retailer incentive with Spike burning the Twilight mask, and the NYCC exclusive.
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patxshand
Ensouled Vampire
Writer/director/Amy Acker's husband.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,918
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Post by patxshand on Oct 9, 2010 22:30:43 GMT -5
Not as simple as that. He has a lot of ties at IDW, no? I'm not speaking for Brian because I don't know the situation, but personally I think he wouldn't want to do it out of respect to IDW.
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patxshand
Ensouled Vampire
Writer/director/Amy Acker's husband.[Mo0:0]
Posts: 1,918
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Post by patxshand on Oct 9, 2010 21:00:35 GMT -5
I'm not sure if it's Dark Horse that'd need convincing.
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